Forums/Armchair-GM

none of you people on this site know anything

Créé par: NoWah49
Date de création initiale: 4 nov. 2021
Publié: 4 nov. 2021
Équipe: 2022-23 Golden Knights de Vegas
Explications
This Eichel trade is perfect proof that people on the site overrates players on their own teams. If Eichel can be had for this, and Ristolainen can be traded for what he was traded for; then I don't want to hear that any trade is "way off" or isn't realistic because it's clear that none of us know what these players will actually go for. Well, here's a Knights team next year
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
LISTE DE RÉSERVEANSCAP HIT
Brisson, Brendan3925 000 $
RFAANSCAP HIT
Hague, Nicolas52 750 000 $
Roy, Nicolas2895 000 $
Kolesar, Keegan2895 000 $
UFAANSCAP HIT
Namestnikov, Vladislav41 250 000 $
Transactions
1.
VGK
    ANA
    1. Dadonov, Evgeni
    2. Carrier, William
    Détails additionnels:
    gone
    2.
    VGK
    1. Arvidsson, Viktor (2 100 000 $ retained)
    LAK
    1. 2023 1e round pick (VGK)
    ANNÉE DE REPÊCHAGERONDE 1RONDE 2RONDE 3RONDE 4RONDE 5RONDE 6RONDE 7
    2022
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de NYR
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de CHI
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    2023
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de BUF
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    2024
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de VGK
    TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
    2282 500 000 $82 016 667 $0 $132 500 $483 333 $
    Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
    Logo de VGK
    Pacioretty, Max
    7 000 000 $
    AG
    NTC
    UFA - 1
    Logo de VGK
    Eichel, Jack
    10 000 000 $
    C
    NMC
    UFA - 4
    Logo de VGK
    Stone, Mark
    9 500 000 $
    AD
    NMC
    UFA - 5
    Logo de VGK
    Marchessault, Jonathan
    5 000 000 $
    AG, AD
    NTC
    UFA - 2
    Logo de VGK
    Karlsson, William
    5 900 000 $
    C
    NTC
    UFA - 5
    Logo de LAK
    Arvidsson, Viktor
    2 150 000 $
    AD, AG
    UFA - 2
    Logo de VGK
    Brisson, Brendan
    925 000 $
    C, AG, AD
    RFA - 3
    Logo de VGK
    Stephenson, Chandler
    2 750 000 $
    C, AG
    UFA - 2
    Namestnikov, Vladislav
    1 250 000 $
    AD, AG, C
    UFA
    Logo de VGK
    Kolesar, Keegan
    895 000 $
    AD, C
    RFA
    Logo de VGK
    Patrick, Nolan
    1 200 000 $
    C, AD
    RFA - 1
    Logo de VGK
    Roy, Nicolas
    895 000 $
    C, AD
    RFA
    Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
    Logo de VGK
    Martinez, Alec
    5 250 000 $
    DG
    NTC
    UFA - 2
    Logo de VGK
    Pietrangelo, Alex
    8 800 000 $
    DD
    NMC
    UFA - 5
    Logo de VGK
    Lehner, Robin
    5 000 000 $
    G
    NTC
    UFA - 3
    Logo de VGK
    Theodore, Shea
    5 200 000 $
    DG/DD
    UFA - 3
    Logo de VGK
    Whitecloud, Zach
    2 750 000 $
    DD
    UFA - 6
    Logo de VGK
    Brossoit, Laurent
    2 325 000 $
    G
    UFA - 1
    Logo de VGK
    Hague, Nicolas
    2 750 000 $
    DG
    RFA
    Logo de VGK
    Coghlan, Dylan
    762 500 $
    DD
    RFA - 1
    Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
    Logo de VGK
    Dorofeyev, Pavel
    925 000 $
    C
    RFA - 1
    Logo de VGK
    Korczak, Kaedan
    789 167 $
    DD
    RFA - 2

    Code d'intégration

    • Pour afficher cette équipe sur un autre site Web ou blog, ajoutez ce iFrame à la page appropriée
    • Personnalisez les dimensions dans le code IFrame ci-dessous pour adapter votre site de manière appropriée. Minimum recommandé: 400px.

    Texte intégré

    Cliquer pour surligner
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 13
    #1
    Leafs Sufferer
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: juill. 2019
    Messages: 2,179
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,531
    Who are you calling "you people"?!?!
    Shibbal18, Lenny7, Roysboy72 and 2 others a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 14
    #2
    Démarrer sujet
    NoWah49
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: févr. 2018
    Messages: 3,830
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,155
    Quoting: Ritzy
    Who are you calling "you people"?!?!


    lol, no one in particular. just drives me crazy
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 15
    #3
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: juin 2018
    Messages: 3,076
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,951
    You want the Kings to retain $4M to send their division rival a bargain $2M sniper? I mean... no.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 15
    #4
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: mars 2017
    Messages: 2,647
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,223
    Thats because most of ppl here dont understand nuance and are HS'rs.

    Trading is never about value. Its a negotiation not mathematics unless you are dealing with the cap hits, themselves. Trading is about timing and leverage.

    I swear most ppl here would starve to death if they became stranded in the woods. Because they have no life experience when it comes to real value

    "No i wont trade you my rolex watch for an apple, i rather starve!" -Capfriendly user
    NoWah49 et Roysboy72 a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 16
    #5
    Démarrer sujet
    NoWah49
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: févr. 2018
    Messages: 3,830
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,155
    Quoting: OlegP
    Thats because most of ppl here dont understand nuance and are HS'rs.

    Trading is never about value. Its a negotiation not mathematics unless you are dealing with the cap hits, themselves. Trading is about timing and leverage.

    I swear most ppl here would starve to death if they became stranded in the woods. Because they have no life experience when it comes to real value

    "No i wont trade you my rolex watch for an apple, i rather starve!" -Capfriendly user


    well said.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 17
    #6
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: août 2020
    Messages: 7,472
    Mentions "j'aime": 6,206
    I mean this is pretty much what I thought he'd go for. If anything the packages I offered for Eichel were more than this lol. Risto is an enigma, there are still hockey men that see a big right shot D and say gimme regardless of what the numbers or even the eye test say (same deal with Jones), but that's just old people with outdated thinking making poor decisions, not people undervaluing a player.
    NoWah49, Lenny7 et KINGS67 a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 18
    #7
    Shibbal18
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: janv. 2016
    Messages: 19,966
    Mentions "j'aime": 6,062
    Quoting: NoWah49
    lol, no one in particular. just drives me crazy


    Are you saying Sabres W or L for context
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 20
    #8
    Shibbal18
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: janv. 2016
    Messages: 19,966
    Mentions "j'aime": 6,062
    Quoting: OlegP
    Thats because most of ppl here dont understand nuance and are HS'rs.

    Trading is never about value. Its a negotiation not mathematics unless you are dealing with the cap hits, themselves. Trading is about timing and leverage.

    I swear most ppl here would starve to death if they became stranded in the woods. Because they have no life experience when it comes to real value

    "No i wont trade you my rolex watch for an apple, i rather starve!" -Capfriendly user


    Why trade a rolex for an apple when you could kill a deer, food for a month and shelter
    Ritzy a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 23
    #9
    Who adds what?
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: juill. 2017
    Messages: 13,677
    Mentions "j'aime": 2,702
    Quoting: OlegP
    Thats because most of ppl here dont understand nuance and are HS'rs.

    Trading is never about value. Its a negotiation not mathematics unless you are dealing with the cap hits, themselves. Trading is about timing and leverage.

    I swear most ppl here would starve to death if they became stranded in the woods. Because they have no life experience when it comes to real value

    "No i wont trade you my rolex watch for an apple, i rather starve!" -Capfriendly user


    Context is important, too.

    We talking apple watch, or like a mac pro?
    OlegP et SociallyHawkward a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 24
    #10
    Otter Supremacy
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: oct. 2017
    Messages: 28,218
    Mentions "j'aime": 24,862
    Fans can only make "educated guesses" of what's going to happen, as they're no professionals. In the end everything we do here is subjective and based on opinions, and for a fan a player's value is their subjective feeling of how much should the asset get back based on their own evaluation, other background info like statistics and comparables of the past, as well as the consensus opinion given by other people. That's the whole point of fans discussing about trades.

    My point is that if one posts a trade that the consensus opinion calls idiotic and unrealistic, then in this context it's probably just that. It doesn't mean it couldn't happen, but if it does there's not much sense behind it. And this is why there's almost never a trade of which the fans of both participants can consider fair.

    If you don't want to hear your trade idea being "way off" or "unrealistic", you're probably in the wrong place, because when things are subjective there's always going to be opinions who think this way.
    Lenny7, RedWing9119, SociallyHawkward and 1 other person a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 29
    #11
    Lenny7
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: janv. 2017
    Messages: 10,608
    Mentions "j'aime": 8,219
    Quoting: Alfie11
    I mean this is pretty much what I thought he'd go for. If anything the packages I offered for Eichel were more than this lol. Risto is an enigma, there are still hockey men that see a big right shot D and say gimme regardless of what the numbers or even the eye test say (same deal with Jones), but that's just old people with outdated thinking making poor decisions, not people undervaluing a player.


    This! The fact that the trade came basically in the middle of what a lot of the proposals here had it for actually says a lot. Risto? Well...sometimes you can't cure old school gm stupidity tears of joy
    RedWing9119 et Alfie11 a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 30
    #12
    L
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: juill. 2021
    Messages: 2,092
    Mentions "j'aime": 2,153
    We love assigning L’s and W’s, it’s quite the fun ordeal. The reason there’s not much nuance or negotiation with deals on this site is because:

    1. We aren’t real GMs. Sure, it’s fun to act like one, but at the end of the day it’s called “Armchair GM” for a reason.
    2. Do you think people on the internet would not just have an opinion, but also accept the opposing opinions of others? A difficult task.
    3. You’re right, we’re stupid compared to real GMs. At the end of the day though, we can say “We told you so!” when a trade goes awry and ignore the ones we get wrong. Remember, there aren’t any stakes here.
    NoWah49, Lenny7 et Anus_McLeod a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 32
    #13
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: nov. 2018
    Messages: 9,290
    Mentions "j'aime": 3,335
    Quoting: NoWah49
    lol, no one in particular. just drives me crazy


    I was actually closer to the value Vegas got several times. I had posted a ton of proposals that I said were max I would pay for Eichel. See thread below for a comparable offer that was laughed at.

    https://www.capfriendly.com/forums/thread/501404
    NoWah49 a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 32
    #14
    Leafs Sufferer
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: juill. 2019
    Messages: 2,179
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,531
    Quoting: Roysboy72
    We love assigning L’s and W’s, it’s quite the fun ordeal. The reason there’s not much nuance or negotiation with deals on this site is because:

    1. We aren’t real GMs. Sure, it’s fun to act like one, but at the end of the day it’s called “Armchair GM” for a reason.
    2. Do you think people on the internet would not just have an opinion, but also accept the opposing opinions of others? A difficult task.
    3. You’re right, we’re stupid compared to real GMs. At the end of the day though, we can say “We told you so!” when a trade goes awry and ignore the ones we get wrong. Remember, there aren’t any stakes here.


    Hey, enough with the logic. We don't do that here.
    Roysboy72, NoWah49 et Lenny7 a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 33
    #15
    Otter Supremacy
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: oct. 2017
    Messages: 28,218
    Mentions "j'aime": 24,862
    Quoting: Roysboy72
    We love assigning L’s and W’s, it’s quite the fun ordeal. The reason there’s not much nuance or negotiation with deals on this site is because:

    1. We aren’t real GMs. Sure, it’s fun to act like one, but at the end of the day it’s called “Armchair GM” for a reason.
    2. Do you think people on the internet would not just have an opinion, but also accept the opposing opinions of others? A difficult task.
    3. You’re right, we’re stupid compared to real GMs. At the end of the day though, we can say “We told you so!” when a trade goes awry and ignore the ones we get wrong. Remember, there aren’t any stakes here.


    To be fair I wouldn't even call us stupid compared to real GMs considering how often we see a GM fleecing another. Pretty much every fan here saw that the Jones trade for example was a mistake of epic proportions and well for now it seems the fans were exactly right on that.
    Roysboy72 et Lenny7 a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 34
    #16
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: sept. 2020
    Messages: 3,284
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,338
    Sabres shot themselves in the foot. If they retain 2-3/ur that opens up the market and drives up price. When the only two teams willing to pay up don’t really have an a plus prospect this is what you get as teams looking to win won’t give up a top roster player like tkachuk or Theodore
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 34
    #17
    Démarrer sujet
    NoWah49
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: févr. 2018
    Messages: 3,830
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,155
    Quoting: Shibbal18
    Are you saying Sabres W or L for context


    well a lot of deals on here were like this and got lit up. I like the deal for Buffalo tho, tough to get a lot more than this with the current situation. It'll be even better if they trade Tuch for even more assets. That first being protected is tough tho
    Eli a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 35
    #18
    MisstheWhalers
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: janv. 2019
    Messages: 17,417
    Mentions "j'aime": 8,315
    Quoting: NoWah49
    lol, no one in particular. just drives me crazy


    Then why debate anything on here, CapFriendly should just shutdown the ACGM section.
    Lenny7 a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 38
    #19
    Shibbal18
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: janv. 2016
    Messages: 19,966
    Mentions "j'aime": 6,062
    Quoting: NoWah49
    well a lot of deals on here were like this and got lit up. I like the deal for Buffalo tho, tough to get a lot more than this with the current situation. It'll be even better if they trade Tuch for even more assets. That first being protected is tough tho


    Tuch is only 25 and something the Sabres have nothing comparable, theyll keep him and he seems excited to join them, hes from Syracuse which is only 2.5 hours away. I also didnt think vegas would miss the playoffs so never anticipated a top 16 pick let alone top 10
    NoWah49 et Roysboy72 a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 39
    #20
    Démarrer sujet
    NoWah49
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: févr. 2018
    Messages: 3,830
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,155
    Quoting: justaBoss
    Fans can only make "educated guesses" of what's going to happen, as they're no professionals. In the end everything we do here is subjective and based on opinions, and for a fan a player's value is their subjective feeling of how much should the asset get back based on their own evaluation, other background info like statistics and comparables of the past, as well as the consensus opinion given by other people. That's the whole point of fans discussing about trades.

    My point is that if one posts a trade that the consensus opinion calls idiotic and unrealistic, then in this context it's probably just that. It doesn't mean it couldn't happen, but if it does there's not much sense behind it. And this is why there's almost never a trade of which the fans of both participants can consider fair.

    If you don't want to hear your trade idea being "way off" or "unrealistic", you're probably in the wrong place, because when things are subjective there's always going to be opinions who think this way.


    i agree, it is all subjective. it's just wild to me seeing how defensive people on here get about trades that they know nothing about. on almost every AGM, you'll see someone getting **** on for something dumb like a depth player for a 3rd.
    justaBoss, Roysboy72 et OlegP a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 39
    #21
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: mars 2017
    Messages: 2,647
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,223
    Quoting: Campabee
    I was actually closer to the value Vegas got several times. I had posted a ton of proposals that I said were max I would pay for Eichel. See thread below for a comparable offer that was laughed at.

    https://www.capfriendly.com/forums/thread/501404


    Same. I offered much more and was told it was idiotic, by most. There are such things as constructive criticism which is, sadly, rarely found here. Its mostly, lazy tribal behaviour from a lot of sad ppl on the internet that need affirmation more so than a community. This place is ok in small doses but to try and actually have a well thought out discussion, extremely uncommon
    NoWah49, Campabee et Anus_McLeod a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 40
    #22
    Démarrer sujet
    NoWah49
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: févr. 2018
    Messages: 3,830
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,155
    Quoting: Shibbal18
    Tuch is only 25 and something the Sabres have nothing comparable, theyll keep him and he seems excited to join them, hes from Syracuse which is only 2.5 hours away. I also didnt think vegas would miss the playoffs so never anticipated a top 16 pick let alone top 10


    right, I don't see that pick that's anywhere near 15, but to have the option open with all the injuries they have right now would be nice
    Shibbal18 a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 41
    #23
    Démarrer sujet
    NoWah49
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: févr. 2018
    Messages: 3,830
    Mentions "j'aime": 1,155
    Quoting: OlegP
    Same. I offered much more and was told it was idiotic by most. There are such things as constructive criticism which is sadly, rarely found here. Its mostly lazy tribal behaviour from a lot of sad ppl on the internet that need affirmation more so than a community. This place is ok in small doses but to try and actually have a well thought out discussion, extremely uncommon


    and that right there is my problem. this site is still fun for me, sometimes the banter can be entertaining, but constructive criticism and why a trade isn't good is preferred over just people talking **** with no basis
    Campabee et Anus_McLeod a aimé ceci.
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 43
    #24
    Shibbal18
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: janv. 2016
    Messages: 19,966
    Mentions "j'aime": 6,062
    Quoting: OlegP
    Same. I offered much more and was told it was idiotic, by most. There are such things as constructive criticism which is, sadly, rarely found here. Its mostly, lazy tribal behaviour from a lot of sad ppl on the internet that need affirmation more so than a community. This place is ok in small doses but to try and actually have a well thought out discussion, extremely uncommon


    Dadonov, Evgeni
    Hague, Nicolas
    2022 1st round pick (VGK
    )2023 1st round pick (VGK)
    2022 2nd round pick (VGK)

    Unless you were talking about another trade, thats not more and a considerably worse trade for Buffalo. Your other Vegas ACGM nearly hit the nail on the head though
    4 nov. 2021 à 14 h 43
    #25
    Lenny7
    Avatar de l'utilisateur
    Rejoint: janv. 2017
    Messages: 10,608
    Mentions "j'aime": 8,219
    Quoting: OlegP
    Trading is never about value. Its a negotiation not mathematics unless you are dealing with the cap hits, themselves. Trading is about timing and leverage.


    I feel like, ignoring the hilarious "nose in the air" "holier than thou" snarky comments, you're really contradicting yourself here.

    Value is affected BY timing and leverage. It doesn't just not exist.
     
    Répondre
    To create a post please Login or S'inscrire
    Question:
    Options:
    Ajouter une option
    Supprimer une option
    Soumettre le sondage