Forums/Armchair-GM

Now for DB1899

Créé par: joshelkin
Date de création initiale: 27 oct. 2021
Publié: 27 oct. 2021
Équipe: 2023-24 Islanders de New York
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
RFAANSCAP HIT
Dobson, Noah23 000 000 $
Salo, Robin21 250 000 $
Barzal, Mathew89 000 000 $
Wilde, Bode2800 000 $
Wahlstrom, Oliver33 333 333 $
Skarek, Jakub2800 000 $
Bolduc, Samuel2800 000 $
Dal Colle, Michael2800 000 $
UFAANSCAP HIT
Clutterbuck, Cal11 500 000 $
Forsberg, Filip67 000 000 $
Lindholm, Hampus75 500 000 $
Merrill, Jon1775 000 $
Bardreau, Cole1775 000 $
Transactions
1.
NYI
  1. 2022 1e round pick (EDM)
Last year
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    Varly extended
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    1. 2022 2e round pick (TBL)
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    1. Bailey, Josh
    3.
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      Lindholm UFA rights

      Last year
      ANA
      1. Bellows, Kieffer [Droits de RFA]
      2. 2022 3e round pick (NYI)
      Rachats de contrats
      • Rick DiPietro: 0 $
      ANNÉE DE REPÊCHAGERONDE 1RONDE 2RONDE 3RONDE 4RONDE 5RONDE 6RONDE 7
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      TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS BONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
      2383 500 000 $82 742 500 $0 $32 500 $757 500 $
      Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
      NYI
      Lee, Anders
      7 000 000 $
      AG, C
      NTC
      UFA - 3
      NYI
      Barzal, Mathew
      9 000 000 $
      C
      RFA
      NYI
      Wahlstrom, Oliver
      3 333 333 $
      AD, C
      RFA
      Forsberg, Filip
      7 000 000 $
      AG
      UFA
      NYI
      Nelson, Brock
      6 000 000 $
      C, AG
      NTC
      UFA - 2
      NYI
      Palmieri, Kyle
      5 000 000 $
      AD, AG
      NTC
      UFA - 2
      NYI
      Beauvillier, Anthony
      4 150 000 $
      AG
      UFA - 1
      NYI
      Pageau, Jean-Gabriel
      5 000 000 $
      C
      NTC
      UFA - 3
      NYI
      Räty, Aatu
      859 167 $
      C
      RFA - 1
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      Martin, Matt
      1 500 000 $
      AG, AD
      UFA - 1
      NYI
      Cizikas, Casey
      2 500 000 $
      C
      UFA - 4
      NYI
      Clutterbuck, Cal
      1 500 000 $
      AD
      UFA
      Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
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      Pelech, Adam
      5 750 000 $
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      Pulock, Ryan
      6 150 000 $
      DD
      NTC
      UFA - 7
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      Sorokin, Ilya
      4 000 000 $
      G
      UFA - 1
      Lindholm, Hampus
      5 500 000 $
      DG
      UFA
      NYI
      Dobson, Noah
      3 000 000 $
      DD
      RFA
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      Skarek, Jakub
      800 000 $
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      RFA
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      Salo, Robin
      1 250 000 $
      DG
      RFA
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      Wilde, Bode
      800 000 $
      DD
      RFA
      Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
      NYI
      Johnston, Ross
      1 100 000 $
      AG
      UFA - 3
      Merrill, Jon
      775 000 $
      DG
      UFA - 2
      NYI
      Bardreau, Cole
      775 000 $
      C
      UFA

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      27 oct. 2021 à 15 h 49
      #1
      Islanders Fan
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      @db1899 see? there is room for it. Cap is actually $25k less than it should be because I gave Merrill $750x2 in last post but it won't let me here with new minimum of $775k. You could spend the additional cap leftover on a slightly better G if you don't trust Skarek. Save money by sending Ross down for a vet min deal. Etc. Money is there
      27 oct. 2021 à 16 h 4
      #2
      Rejoint: août 2021
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      Quoting: joshelkin
      db1899 see? there is room for it. Cap is actually $25k less than it should be because I gave Merrill $750x2 in last post but it won't let me here with new minimum of $775k. You could spend the additional cap leftover on a slightly better G if you don't trust Skarek. Save money by sending Ross down for a vet min deal. Etc. Money is there


      I’m saying there’s no room because there is no chance Lindholm takes 5.5 and Barzal is 100% getting more than 9 mill.
      27 oct. 2021 à 16 h 16
      #3
      Rejoint: juin 2021
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      Ducks aren’t doing that
      27 oct. 2021 à 16 h 28
      #4
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      Quoting: GeneralLandro
      Ducks aren’t doing that


      It's under the assumption you're losing him for nothing. He's a UFA. If he told the ducks he's out of course you would take what you could get for his rights
      27 oct. 2021 à 16 h 29
      #5
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      Quoting: Db1899
      I’m saying there’s no room because there is no chance Lindholm takes 5.5 and Barzal is 100% getting more than 9 mill.


      Did you see Pulock or Pelech taking the deals they did? My guess is no. I don't see how you can say that with so much certainty. Lindholm? Sure. He owns the Isles nothing. $9m fair for Barzal. Could be push for $10m? I guess. But no guarantee. But he shouldn't exceed Barkov that's lunacy.
      27 oct. 2021 à 16 h 30
      #6
      Rejoint: nov. 2016
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      Isles should not be signing Forsberg for $7M, they are going to need to sign Wahlstrom to a larger deal then that.
      27 oct. 2021 à 16 h 31
      #7
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      Quoting: Warrior24
      Isles should not be signing Forsberg for $7M, they are going to need to sign Wahlstrom to a larger deal then that.


      It's a 3 year bridge no real difference than what Beau initially got. They should absolutely sign a big fish
      27 oct. 2021 à 16 h 39
      #8
      Banni
      Rejoint: juin 2016
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      First off you grossly overvalue Bellows and the islanders 2022 3rd round pick, And grossly undervalue Hampus Lindholm. And the signing of Lindholm is even more laughable. As there's no freaking way he's signing for 7 x $5,500,000 he stays in Anaheim for that lowball offer. he's not signing for only a $295,000 raise on a 7 year deal.
      27 oct. 2021 à 16 h 47
      #9
      Rejoint: août 2021
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      Quoting: joshelkin
      Did you see Pulock or Pelech taking the deals they did? My guess is no. I don't see how you can say that with so much certainty. Lindholm? Sure. He owns the Isles nothing. $9m fair for Barzal. Could be push for $10m? I guess. But no guarantee. But he shouldn't exceed Barkov that's lunacy.


      Palmieri didn't take a discount, neither did Martin (he's a league minimum player). A few years ago Lou was trying to get Lee signed for 6 mill x 5 and ended up having to pay him 7x7. It doesn't matter what is fair, Barzal is a very confident guy and he's going to want to get paid . If Barzal was pushing for 9 mill x 5-6 years with no arb rights, what makes you think he's going to settle for that on an 8 year deal with arbitration rights? He's making 10 mill next season, you think he's going to take a discount? I think at minimum he gets 10 mill x 8 .
      27 oct. 2021 à 17 h 11
      #10
      Rejoint: juill. 2021
      Messages: 1,248
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      Quoting: Db1899
      Palmieri didn't take a discount, neither did Martin (he's a league minimum player). A few years ago Lou was trying to get Lee signed for 6 mill x 5 and ended up having to pay him 7x7. It doesn't matter what is fair, Barzal is a very confident guy and he's going to want to get paid . If Barzal was pushing for 9 mill x 5-6 years with no arb rights, what makes you think he's going to settle for that on an 8 year deal with arbitration rights? He's making 10 mill next season, you think he's going to take a discount? I think at minimum he gets 10 mill x 8 .


      i feel like he’ll get 10 too but he’s an interesting case. barzal’s scoring’s not up there with other 10m players. he’s scored at PPG pace just once in his career. a lot of that is the system, but like, how much is it really? undeniably an incredibly talented player but more of a 70 point guy than a 90 point guy right now. so is 10m an overpay? or not? i’d give him 10x8 just to keep him here tbh but i can see why people think he might end up getting less. i feel like 9-9.5x8 is probably what’s most fair for what he brings but after JT, they’re just going to give him whatever he wants as long as he’ll sign for 8 years imo.
      27 oct. 2021 à 17 h 19
      #11
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      Quoting: Db1899
      Palmieri didn't take a discount, neither did Martin (he's a league minimum player). A few years ago Lou was trying to get Lee signed for 6 mill x 5 and ended up having to pay him 7x7. It doesn't matter what is fair, Barzal is a very confident guy and he's going to want to get paid . If Barzal was pushing for 9 mill x 5-6 years with no arb rights, what makes you think he's going to settle for that on an 8 year deal with arbitration rights? He's making 10 mill next season, you think he's going to take a discount? I think at minimum he gets 10 mill x 8 .


      Martin took less to stay here lol - or at least stretched out the years to keep AAV down. You may think he's a minimum player but the league didn't apparently. There were multiple deals on the table with Lee depending on whether or not we got Panarin. So that's not a surprise either.

      Palms took roughly market value. It's splitting hairs there. Between what Hyman, Coleman, Saad etc. took it's in the ballpark. But Palms got the shortest term of the bunch. Lou didn't want to keep that guy around into his late 30's and I can't fault him for that.

      Look, if Barzal wanted $10x8 and wouldn't budge, does he get it? Probbbbably. But I'm willing to bet $9m gets it done just as well. It'll push him to nearly $100m career earnings. He'll still get his security of knowing where he is (and loves) while getting paid a boatload. Disputing $1m/year in the grand scheme of everything else that took place in this post seems silly. And to Lindholm for a sec? $5.5 in theory can go to any LD. Want to take Giordano as a stop gap there for a season or two? Fine. It gets the job done and there's ample space to fill a roster
      27 oct. 2021 à 17 h 31
      #12
      Rejoint: août 2021
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      Quoting: bagelbob
      i feel like he’ll get 10 too but he’s an interesting case. barzal’s scoring’s not up there with other 10m players. he’s scored at PPG pace just once in his career. a lot of that is the system, but like, how much is it really? undeniably an incredibly talented player but more of a 70 point guy than a 90 point guy right now. so is 10m an overpay? or not? i’d give him 10x8 just to keep him here tbh but i can see why people think he might end up getting less. i feel like 9-9.5x8 is probably what’s most fair for what he brings but after JT, they’re just going to give him whatever he wants as long as he’ll sign for 8 years imo.


      It's not the system, it's the lack of PP production due to Trotz not putting a sniper on the opposite side. Barzal produces at an elite rate at 5v5, I know he was in the top 15 among forwards last year and that was despite having Komarov on his lw... Palmieri and Wahlstrom are both great 1T options, for whatever reason Trotz refuses to put Palmieri in the ovi spot and Wahlstrom rarely gets put on the same unit as Barzal. Wahlstrom + Barzal have been on the same PP 4 times, Wahlstrom scored twice. If Barzal gets a full season with one of them in the ovi spot he'll be a PPG player.

      I think if Barzal was a UFA in his age 26 season , he would easily get 11 mill if not more. Best transition player in the NHL, great at driving play at even strength and on the PP. Elite playmaker and skater. He has it all.
      Islesforthecup a aimé ceci.
      27 oct. 2021 à 17 h 39
      #13
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      Quoting: joshelkin
      Martin took less to stay here lol - or at least stretched out the years to keep AAV down. You may think he's a minimum player but the league didn't apparently. There were multiple deals on the table with Lee depending on whether or not we got Panarin. So that's not a surprise either.

      Palms took roughly market value. It's splitting hairs there. Between what Hyman, Coleman, Saad etc. took it's in the ballpark. But Palms got the shortest term of the bunch. Lou didn't want to keep that guy around into his late 30's and I can't fault him for that.

      Look, if Barzal wanted $10x8 and wouldn't budge, does he get it? Probbbbably. But I'm willing to bet $9m gets it done just as well. It'll push him to nearly $100m career earnings. He'll still get his security of knowing where he is (and loves) while getting paid a boatload. Disputing $1m/year in the grand scheme of everything else that took place in this post seems silly. And to Lindholm for a sec? $5.5 in theory can go to any LD. Want to take Giordano as a stop gap there for a season or two? Fine. It gets the job done and there's ample space to fill a roster


      Martin took less? He wasn't getting more than 1.5 x 2 from another team. Who is an example of a 4th line grinder who doesn't PK getting more than 1.5-1.75 mill?

      Palms took slightly above market value considering his age. Palmieri should have gotten 4.5 x 4 , Saad is 2 years younger. He definitely didn't take a discount lol. He's a good player but he had a bad season last year and didn't score once in the Tampa series.

      Disagree on Barzal but we'll see. He knows he would get 11 mill as a UFA. Regarding Lindholm I just don't see any scenario where he takes less than 7 mill. He's a top pair D, which the isles do not need. The isles need an average two way D like Ian Cole or someone like that for a year. Pelech-Pulock, Salo-Dobson, Cole-Mayfield
      27 oct. 2021 à 19 h 2
      #14
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      Quoting: Db1899
      Martin took less? He wasn't getting more than 1.5 x 2 from another team. Who is an example of a 4th line grinder who doesn't PK getting more than 1.5-1.75 mill?

      Palms took slightly above market value considering his age. Palmieri should have gotten 4.5 x 4 , Saad is 2 years younger. He definitely didn't take a discount lol. He's a good player but he had a bad season last year and didn't score once in the Tampa series.

      Disagree on Barzal but we'll see. He knows he would get 11 mill as a UFA. Regarding Lindholm I just don't see any scenario where he takes less than 7 mill. He's a top pair D, which the isles do not need. The isles need an average two way D like Ian Cole or someone like that for a year. Pelech-Pulock, Salo-Dobson, Cole-Mayfield


      Yeah that's what I'm saying with Palms. He's more in line with Saad on more term. I was hoping for $4x5 but Lou reversed those numbers lol. More I think about it, I'm fine with what he got.

      And Martin? I'll take word from his father in law... Lol https://twitter.com/rtaub_/status/1346826246051799040?s=21
      27 oct. 2021 à 19 h 26
      #15
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      Quoting: joshelkin
      Yeah that's what I'm saying with Palms. He's more in line with Saad on more term. I was hoping for $4x5 but Lou reversed those numbers lol. More I think about it, I'm fine with what he got.

      And Martin? I'll take word from his father in law... Lol https://twitter.com/rtaub_/status/1346826246051799040?s=21


      Saad was on pace for 28 goals during the regular season , plus he had 7 goals in 10 playoffs games. Saad deserved more than palmieri. Evolving hockey has a contract projection portion of their website which is usually spot on. They projected 4.3 mill x 3 based on what players who produced like palmieri got from teams in free agency in the past. My point is Palmieri was not a discount , it was slightly about market value.

      Yeah I remember that and I'm pretty sure Friedman said the same thing. We're talking about 1.75 x 2 vs 1.5 x 4. Taking 1.5 x 4 is not a discount. Taking more term to lower the cap hit is not taking a discount, especially when it comes to replacement level players like Martin. Term matters. Pelech and Pulock took discounts because they both could have gotten over 7 mill in free agency.
      27 oct. 2021 à 19 h 30
      #16
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      Quoting: joshelkin
      Yeah that's what I'm saying with Palms. He's more in line with Saad on more term. I was hoping for $4x5 but Lou reversed those numbers lol. More I think about it, I'm fine with what he got.

      And Martin? I'll take word from his father in law... Lol https://twitter.com/rtaub_/status/1346826246051799040?s=21



      27 oct. 2021 à 19 h 34
      #17
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      Quoting: Db1899



      I like NRD a lot. Don't think what he's saying was inaccurate. But "range" is still subjective though. A deal could start with a $9. Also, the tweet is before our most recent run and again, guys before him just took discounts. Why can't that influence him now?
      27 oct. 2021 à 19 h 40
      #18
      Rejoint: nov. 2020
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      Quoting: joshelkin
      Did you see Pulock or Pelech taking the deals they did? My guess is no. I don't see how you can say that with so much certainty. Lindholm? Sure. He owns the Isles nothing. $9m fair for Barzal. Could be push for $10m? I guess. But no guarantee. But he shouldn't exceed Barkov that's lunacy.


      Yeah but youre saying he should exceed point? Thats also lunacy. The answer is that 10 million in florida is significantly more than 10 million in NY.
      27 oct. 2021 à 19 h 56
      #19
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      Quoting: joshelkin
      I like NRD a lot. Don't think what he's saying was inaccurate. But "range" is still subjective though. A deal could start with a $9. Also, the tweet is before our most recent run and again, guys before him just took discounts. Why can't that influence him now?


      Friedman said Barzal was using Marner (10.9 x 6) as a comparable on a long term deal. It's easy to see where his head is at. I believe he wants to stay, but he's going to want to get PAID - and again not everyone took discounts. Just Pelech and Pulock. Palmieri wouldn't have gotten more than 5 mill x 4 on the open market, tbh he might've not gotten that lol.
      27 oct. 2021 à 20 h 10
      #20
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      Quoting: Islesforthecup
      Yeah but youre saying he should exceed point? Thats also lunacy. The answer is that 10 million in florida is significantly more than 10 million in NY.


      Point is 9.5 so me giving Barzal 9 in this post makes sense? That's accurate too - State tax almost plays an unfair advantage to these teams building a roster but that's the game. We'll see what Barzal gets. I don't think it's 10+ but we'll see. Let's enjoy him for another year while he's only making 7 lol
      27 oct. 2021 à 23 h 52
      #21
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      Quoting: joshelkin
      Point is 9.5 so me giving Barzal 9 in this post makes sense? That's accurate too - State tax almost plays an unfair advantage to these teams building a roster but that's the game. We'll see what Barzal gets. I don't think it's 10+ but we'll see. Let's enjoy him for another year while he's only making 7 lol


      I think he gets 8×10.
       
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