Maybe Zucker a replacement? It wouldnt cost as much

Pretty easy decline from Vancouver, doesn’t meet needs or value. Hertl will likely cost more I would imagine. Maybe upgrade the 2nd to a first

wow. Sharks very easily decline that pile of scat. Chmelevski = future 3C. Coe is underrated. Hertl alone costs more than the deal for all three. Really hard pass. Hertl, Coe and Chmelevski, the convo starts with Zadina.

Hertl would likely cost more.
But also the 1st condition on the trade is no longer allowed. The 2nd condition is still ok.

The prospects on the sharks side are worth more to me than the ones your offering and thats ignoring the first line center

Canucks and Sharks aren't trading top six forwards for a bunch of garbage

How does any of these guys replace Vrana?

Or Detroit doesn’t make a short sighted trade and instead has another bottom 5 season and gets a stud prospect to go along with the future core of Seider, Edvinsson, Cossa, Zadina and Raymond

Everyone says no!

Yeah no.

Why would Detroit do any of these? These are all very bad for Detroit.

Miller and hertl are both better than vrana

Sure. Just not at offense.

Both of them outscored vrana last year and the year prior

And that's why Vrana demanded a trade to a team where he could play 1LW. The next three years, neither of them will outscore Vrana. But each will continue to play better defense than he does.

Maybe Miller, but if you think he'll out score Hertl... well buddy, maybe watch some sharks games.

Miller is 0.97 points per game past two regular seasons. 18 points in 17 playoff games in 2020.

.97 points per game is 35th in the nhlers over the last two seasons and ahead of hertl (0.81) and vrana (0.74).

Vrana wasn't even on the Caps' top power play, though, so that comparison does not tell you very much. Points/60, last three years, minimum 100 games played, Vrana and Stamkos are tied for 12th at 2.58. Hertl is 23rd at 2.39. Miller is 65th at 2.05. They're all very good, and maybe they could replace each other on some teams?

Since Vrana joined the Red Wings, who needed him on their power play, he has 1.00 points/game and more GWG (3) than the rest of the Red Wings (2).

So the question of who could replace Vrana, in terms of what he brings to Detroit, is absurd. Maybe, like, a cyborg Mario Lemieux?

Why not 3 seasons? Vrana also played less than 15 minutes a night in those seasons so PPG isn’t all the convincing. I’m not arguing one is better than the other but rather pointing out how your analytics specifically cater to your argument while showing complete bias.

Haha. Thank you for catching my typo. The numbers I gave were for the last three seasons. Over just the last two seasons, you have to drop the minimum games played to 80 to get Hertl to show up. Then Vrana's 8th in the league, Miller is 40th, and Hertl is 45th. I'm sure there are stats you can find that show Miller is the greatest ever, but what I remember seeing when other Caps fans wanted to trade Vrana and a 1st for him last year was that Vrana had more even strength points over recent seasons, and since the Caps didn't seem to have a spot open on their power play, I thought they should keep Vrana. A team that needs a power play catalyst might reach the opposite conclusion, though. Points/game can be all you need, if that's what your team is low on. But last year's Caps, I thought, needed Vrana's even strength production in a middle six role.

http://www.nhl.com/stats/skaters?report=scoringRates&reportType=season&seasonFrom=20192020&seasonTo=20202021&gameType=2&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,80&sort=pointsPer605v5,goalsPer605v5&page=0&pageSize=50

Mostly chose 2 years because that’s how long miller has been in Van.

What Eli is suggesting (correct me if I’m wrong here Eli) is that Vrana will have a similar breakout to Detroit that miller had with Vancouver, but it will be so drastic that Miller would not be a comparable or replacement for Vrana.

My argument is that it is unlikely we see Vrana meet miller’s scoring rates he has had over the past 2 season (including playoffs) since Vrana has not scored at that rate on the past. Having a leap of that amount is unlikely imo. I know miller just had it happen, but that’s the exception not the rule



Fair point with the 5v5 scoring. I wonder if vrana’s 17% shooting percentage 5v5 juices his numbers a bit (his career average is 13.7).

also, just because he produced 5v5 in a reduced role does not mean he will continue the same scoring once in an even greater role. Ice time goes up but so does the talent he’s up against.

I guess we can agree to disagree here. I think miller and hertl are better, wouldn’t trade either of them one for one for Vrana.