Forums/NHL Trades

(MTL/ARI) - 2022 conditional 1st round pick and 2024 2nd round pick for Dvorak

Who won the trade?
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5 sep à 3 h 31
#51
Rejoint: déc 2017
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Arizona is such a joke of a franchise. Why not trade Chychrun at this point? He'd net them multiple top assets. Obviously, they're gonna suck for the next 5+ years anyway. Chychrun is on one of the most team-friendly contracts in the entire NHL.
5 sep à 3 h 33
#52
Rejoint: déc 2017
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After watching this play out, I highly doubt we're going to see another OS for a while.
sensonfire a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 6 h 28
#53
sensonfire
Rejoint: fév 2021
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Quoting: Remus
Hurricanes receive: Jesperi Kotkaniemi

Coyotes receive: 2022 first*, 2024 2nd

Habs receive: Christian Dvorak, 2022 1st, 2022 3rd

I think I know who won


Kotkaniemi is not involved in this trade though.
5 sep à 6 h 31
#54
sensonfire
Rejoint: fév 2021
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Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
Biggest winners: Arizona
Biggest Losers: Carolina


Carolina has nothing to do with this trade though.
weirfanno1 a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 6 h 34
#55
sensonfire
Rejoint: fév 2021
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Quoting: draft_em_sign_em_trade_em
Depends who the Yotes Draft.

Draft picks are wasted all the time,

Ahem the Habs 2021 1st Rd pick on Mailloux.

So right now the biggest winner is Habs.
biggest loser Canes.
fair trade Yotes.

All can change if Dorvak is a fish out of water (American playing in Quebec) and under performs.
Canes sign KK to an extension with a lower cap hit.
The Yotes draft 2 future NHL'ers.


The Canes are not involved in this trade.
5 sep à 6 h 41
#56
v5 CBJ GM
Rejoint: oct 2020
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This is an easy Coyotes win simply because it’s Kk and a bit more for Dvorak and Kk has more overall value than Dvorak
sensonfire a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 6 h 48
#57
sensonfire
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This is more than what I suggested in a previous post of mine.


Most people that commented on my post hated the idea for the Habs.


https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/2756717


Coyotes win.
5 sep à 8 h 35
#58
Rejoint: aoû 2021
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Quoting: jpsnow13
Short term win for the Habs. The 2021-2022 line up is better with Dvorak than KK.

Will have to wait the end of the season to see the 1st round picks final ranks. If both are 20+ it would be another W for MTL over ARZ.

Will have to wait 4 years to see if KK realise his potential and become a better player than Dvorak...


I agree and I don't get why more people don't see this: the nhl is the big league...you're supposed to prove yourself then get paid. 4 Years from now and maybe KK is worth it? What a stupid choice by CAR.

At the end of the day MTL traded KK and a 2nd for Dvorak and a 3rd. That's a good deal for MTL.

And anyone who says KK has more potential than Dvorak never saw Dvorak play in the OHL.
jpsnow13 a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 9 h 08
#59
Formerly HabsFan9
Rejoint: jui 2020
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Quoting: NARC311


well they have Dvorak and a 2022 first, regardless of which one gets traded.

lol
5 sep à 9 h 10
#60
Formerly HabsFan9
Rejoint: jui 2020
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Quoting: sensonfire
Kotkaniemi is not involved in this trade though.


But he really is. Consider the fact that the Habs made this move because they lost Kotkaniemi.

C'mon, man.
5 sep à 9 h 11
#61
Formerly HabsFan9
Rejoint: jui 2020
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Quoting: sensonfire
Carolina has nothing to do with this trade though.


C'mon, man
5 sep à 9 h 16
#62
sensonfire
Rejoint: fév 2021
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Quoting: triggerman
I agree and I don't get why more people don't see this: the nhl is the big league...you're supposed to prove yourself then get paid. 4 Years from now and maybe KK is worth it? What a stupid choice by CAR.

At the end of the day MTL traded KK and a 2nd for Dvorak and a 3rd. That's a good deal for MTL.

And anyone who says KK has more potential than Dvorak never saw Dvorak play in the OHL.


At the end of the day, MTL traded what could be a 1st in the top half of the 1st round and a 2nd for Dvorak.

That's a good deal for ARI.



KK and the Canes have absolutely nothing to do with this trade.

It's why the Canes are not an option for voting on who won the trade.
A_Habs_fan a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 9 h 19
#63
exo2769
Rejoint: jui 2015
Messages: 10,624
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Quoting: Saskleaf
Houston is going to be very, very good.


Yotes are likely staying in AZ, but moving to Tempe next to ASU. A.) They've already placed a bid on the dirt, but B.) it's just a genius move for a budget franchise to team up with a state institution that's growing like crazy. Besides, Glendale is impossible to get to for 41 games a year. I would have gone to twice as many games if they were in Tempe.

https://www.tsn.ca/coyotes-submit-proposal-for-two-land-parcels-in-tempe-1.1689208
https://www.novusasu.com/plan/
Saskleaf a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 9 h 21
#64
sensonfire
Rejoint: fév 2021
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Quoting: Remus
But he really is. Consider the fact that the Habs made this move because they lost Kotkaniemi.

C'mon, man.


I'm considering the fact that Habs traded a 2022 conditional 1st and a 2024 2nd to Arizona for Dvorak.

Nothing else to consider here.



You should probably ask whichever staff member for Capfriendly uploaded this trade why Carolina isn't included in this trade.

Or why you can't vote for the Canes on the question "Who won the trade?"
A_Habs_fan a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 9 h 25
#65
Habs4Ever
Rejoint: nov 2016
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Quoting: INeverPlayedHockey
If you look at the big picture CAR is a winner here. They matched Aho offer sheet and robbed KK from that team so I doubt anyone making that move on them anymore. They played well and thanks to their good scouting and developing they afford making a miss with KK.


Robbed is bold because Kotkaniemi played 3rd line last year and still had a - WAR with a 47.9% faceoff wins. The only positive about Kotkaniemi was that he was a 3rd overall pick, but that means nothing now. Canes are the only true loser from yesterday's transactions.
McSchleep et Brian2016 a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 9 h 26
#66
Habs4Ever
Rejoint: nov 2016
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Quoting: sensonfire
Carolina has nothing to do with this trade though.


This trade was made because of something Carolina did. Doesn't matter if they were involved in this particular trade or not.
Remus a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 9 h 26
#67
Evans truther
Rejoint: jui 2019
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Here are my views of the whole thing.
- In a vacuum this trade is an Arizona win (Value wise), but you have to understand this trade isn't in a vacuum and it isn't happening if Montreal isn't getting the picks from Carolina. In that view it's a Montreal win on day one.

- The only sure thing traded today is Dvorak, the rest is loaded with ifs and Montreal was living for far too long on ifs and buts. KK could become better but isn't now, picks could be great but right now they're between 11-32 (Don't start the 1-2 picks thing), drafted players could become great but like Boston in 2015 they could become nothing. Dvorak is Dvorak, a center that'll be even better with better playmaking wingers around him.

- If true that Carolina has looked around the league for top 6 help (Dvorak, Tarasenko and others) I don't understand from a hockey standpoint why they go offersheet KK when they could have had a proven Dvorak for less (An unprotected first is way more valuable than a top 10 protected one). Carolina is obviously looking to compete now before Aho becomes an UFA (Who knows) yet they take the longer project.

- I don't know how this will affect the room in Carolina. If you're a player and you see your team low ball the new guy that carried you in the playoffs and then let go of your top defenseman to just go out of their way and OS someone as part of a vengeance plan... I don't know how well I'd react to that.
5 sep à 9 h 36
#68
sensonfire
Rejoint: fév 2021
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Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
This trade was made because of something Carolina did. Doesn't matter if they were involved in this particular trade or not.


If it didn't matter, the Capfriendly staff member who uploaded this trade would have included Carolina as an option for voting on "Who won the trade?"


Carolina is not the one that overpaid for Dvorak.


The reason why the voting is even this close is because the Coyotes don't have a fanbase on Capfriendly while the Habs have a massive one.
A_Habs_fan et MisstheWhalers a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 9 h 45
#69
sensonfire
Rejoint: fév 2021
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Quoting: ColonelX
Here are my views of the whole thing.
- In a vacuum this trade is an Arizona win (Value wise), but you have to understand this trade isn't in a vacuum and it isn't happening if Montreal isn't getting the picks from Carolina. In that view it's a Montreal win on day one.

- The only sure thing traded today is Dvorak, the rest is loaded with ifs and Montreal was living for far too long on ifs and buts. KK could become better but isn't now, picks could be great but right now they're between 11-32 (Don't start the 1-2 picks thing), drafted players could become great but like Boston in 2015 they could become nothing. Dvorak is Dvorak, a center that'll be even better with better playmaking wingers around him.

- If true that Carolina has looked around the league for top 6 help (Dvorak, Tarasenko and others) I don't understand from a hockey standpoint why they go offersheet KK when they could have had a proven Dvorak for less (An unprotected first is way more valuable than a top 10 protected one). Carolina is obviously looking to compete now before Aho becomes an UFA (Who knows) yet they take the longer project.

- I don't know how this will affect the room in Carolina. If you're a player and you see your team low ball the new guy that carried you in the playoffs and then let go of your top defenseman to just go out of their way and OS someone as part of a vengeance plan... I don't know how well I'd react to that.


What I have to understand is that Carolina has absolutely nothing to do with this trade.

Otherwise, they would be a voting option on the question, "Who won the trade?"


Montreal overpaid for Dvorak.

In my view, it's a Montreal loss on day one.
A_Habs_fan a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 9 h 53
#70
Rejoint: aoû 2021
Messages: 4
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Quoting: sensonfire
At the end of the day, MTL traded what could be a 1st in the top half of the 1st round and a 2nd for Dvorak.

That's a good deal for ARI.



KK and the Canes have absolutely nothing to do with this trade.

It's why the Canes are not an option for voting on who won the trade.


Never said anything about whether or not the Canes won the trade. Montreal still has a first round pick, just like they did 8 days ago. They won.
5 sep à 9 h 55
#71
You know nothing JS
Rejoint: jan 2017
Messages: 3,880
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Modifié 5 sep à 10 h 00
Quoting: sensonfire
At the end of the day, MTL traded what could be a 1st in the top half of the 1st round and a 2nd for Dvorak.

That's a good deal for ARI.


A bit missleading since the pick has top 10 protection. With CAR and MTL both improved for next season, chances it will end up in the 15th to 20th range.

Quoting: sensonfire

KK and the Canes have absolutely nothing to do with this trade.

It's why the Canes are not an option for voting on who won the trade.


Come on man. This deal just doesn't happen if KK offer sheet is matched. It was made in the same hour, with the compensation received from Carolina and in the objective to replace KK...

From MTL point of view, it's KK + 1st + 2nd for Dvorak +3rd.
faulkmydzingel, Remus et pinslack a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 9 h 55
#72
Nah.
Rejoint: sep 2020
Messages: 1,103
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Modifié 5 sep à 19 h 22
If anything, it’s going to be fun to see how the small army of players AZ picks in the ‘22 draft turn out.
sensonfire et MisstheWhalers a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 10 h 03
#73
sensonfire
Rejoint: fév 2021
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Quoting: KSIxSKULLS
If you had any clue about this site... the reason the Habs are losing this trade is because there are so many Toronto fans on this site. Good try, but you're a terrible troll


If you had any clue about this site, the Capfriendly staff member who uploaded this trade did not include Carolina as a voting option.


Nor did he/she make this into a three-way trade with KK going to Carolina for a 1st and a 3rd.



The reason why the Habs are losing this trade is because the Habs overpaid on Dvorak.

Simple as that.
5 sep à 10 h 08
#74
Its Tru-deau
Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 7,455
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Quoting: Kotkaniemi15
Neither this nor the Kuemper trade are overpayments.

It seems like people on this website really underrate Yotes players.


Quoting: INeverPlayedHockey
Yet Kuemper has been in all projected lineups for Canadas Olympic roster.


Meh I think they are slight overpayments. Both teams were absolutely desperate for the players they were getting.

Kuemper isn't in the starting lineup of most mock team Canada's.
faulkmydzingel et A_Habs_fan a aimé ceci.
5 sep à 10 h 09
#75
sensonfire
Rejoint: fév 2021
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Quoting: triggerman
Never said anything about whether or not the Canes won the trade. Montreal still has a first round pick, just like they did 8 days ago. They won.


I never said the Canes won or lost the trade.

I'm saying the Canes are not included as a voting option on the question "Who won the trade?"

It's because they have nothing to do with it.



Arizona has an additional 1st round pick and an additional 2nd round pick because Montreal overpaid for Dvorak.

Coyotes win.
 
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