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Finishing Touches on an Imperfect Roster

Créé par: BeterChiarelli
Équipe: 2021-22 Oilers d'Edmonton
Date de création initiale: 29 juill. 2021
Publié: 29 juill. 2021
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
This level of detail may appear to be the ramblings of a madman. Take that as you will.

The key foci of this AGM are Winnipeg missing the boat on a backup goaltender and Dallas needing to shed Khudobin in order to find ice time for Oettinger. In this instance I think Edmonton can take advantage of both teams needs: I fully believe that Dobby is too pricey (in acquisition cost and term specifically) for the Jets to go out and get him themselves. I also believe the Jets may want to aim a touch higher than Stalock, who is likely more apt for AHL employment this season. A retained Koskinen remains one of the only options in terms of a readily-available backup netminder besides the remains of Devan Dubnyk: in this instance, the Jets take the better goaltender with upside to maintain or improve upon his .917sv% form. Because Edmonton cannot retain beyond the shown $1M, I have the Oilers recouping Beaulieu (total AAV equals a 50% Koskinen and makes some room on their back end) and a diminished return in a b-prospect and late pick.

I think the peak price on Khudobin given the Stars' desire to make room for Oettinger is a b-prospect and a 3rd round pick. Given the Oilers' cap constraints however, a second round pick probably appeals to the Stars more as I require them to retain just shy of league-minimum AND take Beaulieu off the Oilers' books. Nate can either play or to be buried: in either case, the Stars free up $500k after Oettinger is added to the main roster, $1.5M if they bury Beaulieu. With Bishop on LTIR, could be the difference in adding quality up front before or during the season.

Blink and you'll miss it, Holland mentioned wanting another defenceman to add and is on record of hating having more than four RHD (see: Bear trade). I don't think anyone expects Russell to play an entire season thus I wanted the upgrade to be somewhat substantial within the means of the Oilers' cap situation. I think Murray on a more Cole-esque deal than what he signed for last year is a perfect fit: I wouldn't be surprised to see Murray-Bouchard even emerge as the Oilers' second pair by midseason. The addition of another defender likely means Lagesson is going to be waived: this is poor asset management and the justification for the Minnesota trade, which admittedly only works if the Wild are interested in Lagesson. If the pairings fall as Brodin-Spurgeon, Goligoski-Dumba, and Kulikov-Mermis, Lagesson offers more at a lower price in that #7 slot than AHL journeyman Jon Lizotte. My ask I don't believe is all that extravagant either: Dewar appears to be an AHL tweener/late bloomer and Johansson is one of those names I wanted late in 2018 and appears to be a buy-low candidate. The Oilers system is not flush with RHD with Bouchard graduating and I think SiJo, pending a successful year in Finland, can at the very minimum make an impact at the AHL level. The Oilers as an organization highly value Kris Russell and losing Lagesson to waivers is poor asset management: I think a return similar to Kurtis MacDermid (re: a 4th) is possible here but I have less interest in assets that won't be ready in 4 years as opposed to depth pieces that could contribute in a year or two. Very 'meh' deal from an external POV but a shrewd case of asset management I believe.

Finally, the Canucks trade addresses a miniscule gap in their goaltending depth: I fully expect Silovs to play big minutes in the ECHL this season which means the Canucks are left with Dubnyk, a laundry list of ineffective AHL goaltenders, or the Oilers' Stalock to split starts with DiPietro. Vancouver's new AHL team isn't flush with pivots either and I believe Rasanen has some value as an AHL-ready prospect for their system. I suspect the only reason Edmonton hasn't signed him is his not being a Holland pick and/or Edmonton's hit-or-miss relationship with Finns post-Puljujarvi. I don't know how highly Kunz is regarded in the Canucks' system but I do recognize that he's still likely 2 or 3 years out from the AHL. Because I'm less interested in a draft pick and much more interested in a prospect that would be ready sooner, I think the value is fine regarding Abbotsford acquiring more AHL depth even if Kunz stretches out the definition of 'ready sooner' a touch.

Signings are relatively straightforward: I have Foegele signing his QO as I think the Oilers' brass would appreciate a closer look at what he does for the team before offering him too much money. If Yamamoto comes in lower, Foegele can come in higher. Cairns, Johansson, and Tullio to sign before the AHL playoffs. Rodrigue gets the entire season in the ECHL.
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
RFAANSCAP HIT
2750 000 $
12 150 000 $
2750 000 $
2750 000 $
32 500 000 $
UFAANSCAP HIT
12 000 000 $
Transactions
1.
EDM
  1. Beaulieu, Nathan
  2. Reichel, Kristian
  3. Choix de 5e ronde en 2022 (WPG)
WPG
  1. Koskinen, Mikko (1 000 000 $ retained)
2.
EDM
  1. Khudobin, Anton (683 333 $ retained)
DAL
  1. Beaulieu, Nathan
  2. Choix de 2e ronde en 2023 (EDM)
3.
4.
EDM
  1. Kunz, Jackson [Liste de réserve]
VAN
  1. Räsänen, Aapeli [Liste de réserve]
  2. Stalock, Alex
Rachats de contrats
Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
Enfoui
Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
2022
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de WPG
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
2023
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
2024
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
Logo de EDM
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2381 500 000 $80 796 968 $669 339 $907 500 $703 032 $

Formation

Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
5 500 000 $5 500 000 $
AD, AG
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
12 500 000 $12 500 000 $
C
UFA - 5
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
1 175 000 $1 175 000 $
AD
UFA - 1
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
5 125 000 $5 125 000 $
AG, C
NMC
UFA - 8
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
8 500 000 $8 500 000 $
C, AG
UFA - 4
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
2 500 000 $2 500 000 $
AD
RFA - 1
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
2 150 000 $2 150 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 3
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
834 167 $834 167 $ (Bonis de performance57 500 $$58K)
C
RFA - 1
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
3 200 000 $3 200 000 $
AD
UFA - 3
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
750 000 $750 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 1
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
1 250 000 $1 250 000 $
C, AD
UFA - 2
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
1 500 000 $1 500 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 1
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
5 600 000 $5 600 000 $
DG
UFA - 1
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
4 500 000 $4 500 000 $
DD
UFA - 3
Logo de Stars de Dallas
2 650 000 $2 650 000 $
G
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
5 538 462 $5 538 462 $
DG
NMC
UFA - 2
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
3 250 000 $3 250 000 $
DD
UFA - 4
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
2 200 000 $2 200 000 $
G
UFA - 2
2 000 000 $2 000 000 $
DG
UFA - 1
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
863 333 $863 333 $ (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
DD
RFA - 2
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
1 250 000 $1 250 000 $
DG/DD
UFA - 1
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
4 167 000 $4 167 000 $
DG
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
850 000 $850 000 $
AG, C, AD
UFA - 2
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
750 000 $750 000 $
C, AD
UFA - 1

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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 9
#1
Bedard23
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Jets decline Berdin will play next year
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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 11
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Quoting: IconicHawk
Jets decline Berdin will play next year


That would appear to not be a very good idea. Neither his KHL numbers nor his AHL numbers from the last two seasons imply anything of NHL caliber goaltending.
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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 13
#3
Bedard23
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Quoting: BeterChiarelli
That would appear to not be a very good idea. Neither his KHL numbers nor his AHL numbers from the last two seasons imply anything of NHL caliber goaltending.


Koskinen isn’t any better
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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 15
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Quoting: IconicHawk
Koskinen isn’t any better


Objectively false.

Koskinen's issue is that he was overplayed to start the season and is overpaid. As soon as Smith came back to action this past season Koskinen was above league average in sv% and frequently above .920sv%. He may not be a starter, especially behind Edmonton's blueline, but for a year he is quite literally the best backup available in the league right now.

Check your biases at the door next time smile
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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 15
#5
Bedard23
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You really want us to play Hellebuyck all 82 games next season?
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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 17
#6
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Quoting: IconicHawk
You really want us to play Hellebuyck all 82 games next season?


Running Berdin as a backup will result in Hellebuyck having to play 70+ games. Koskinen is more than capable of playing 30+.

Continued spouting of nonsense will be considered trolling from here on out. I dont care if you disagree but you're yet to provide any rational form of argument as to why Koskinen wouldn't be an effective backup.
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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 17
#7
MisstheWhalers
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Quoting: BeterChiarelli
That would appear to not be a very good idea. Neither his KHL numbers nor his AHL numbers from the last two seasons imply anything of NHL caliber goaltending.


Berdin is pretty good, I've watched a lot of Moose games and he looks solid, not sure if it'll transfer to the NHL but he's good at the AHL whether the numbers show it or not.
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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 18
#8
Jetsfan
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Quoting: BeterChiarelli
Objectively false.

Koskinen's issue is that he was overplayed to start the season and is overpaid. As soon as Smith came back to action this past season Koskinen was above league average in sv% and frequently above .920sv%. He may not be a starter, especially behind Edmonton's blueline, but for a year he is quite literally the best backup available in the league right now.

Check your biases at the door next time smile


Winnipeg is going for either Comrie or Berdin as their backup as we only have space for a 750K goalie...not a 3.5M one
29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 18
#9
Bedard23
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Quoting: BeterChiarelli
Objectively false.

Koskinen's issue is that he was overplayed to start the season and is overpaid. As soon as Smith came back to action this past season Koskinen was above league average in sv% and frequently above .920sv%. He may not be a starter, especially behind Edmonton's blueline, but for a year he is quite literally the best backup available in the league right now.

Check your biases at the door next time smile


Koskinen is way too f*cking expensive for the Jets to afford I’d go the cheaper route and play Berdin (I mean he would barely play any games because Hellebuyck is like a top 2 goalie in the nhl)
29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 20
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Quoting: IconicHawk
Jets decline Berdin will play next year


Quoting: BeterChiarelli
That would appear to not be a very good idea. Neither his KHL numbers nor his AHL numbers from the last two seasons imply anything of NHL caliber goaltending.


Quoting: MisstheWhalers
Berdin is pretty good, I've watched a lot of Moose games and he looks solid, not sure if it'll transfer to the NHL but he's good at the AHL whether the numbers show it or not.


The jets don’t have cap space to make any moves to add another backup. Yesterday, in his interview, chevy said the backup job was comrie’s to lose. That said, the above who said berdin is no good clearly hasn’t seen him play. He had a bit of a down year last year (very good middle half but slow start and tough finish) but he’s still very good.
29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 22
#11
Bedard23
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Quoting: arafay
The jets don’t have cap space to make any moves to add another backup. Yesterday, in his interview, chevy said the backup job was comrie’s to lose. That said, the above who said berdin is no good clearly hasn’t seen him play. He had a bit of a down year last year (very good middle half but slow start and tough finish) but he’s still very good.


Well AHL stats aren’t expected to be good so….
29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 24
#12
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Quoting: IconicHawk
Well AHL stats aren’t expected to be good so….


Sorry, I don’t get what you are trying to say here
29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 24
#13
Bedard23
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Quoting: arafay
Sorry, I don’t get what you are trying to say here


Or meant to
29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 27
#14
MisstheWhalers
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Quoting: arafay
The jets don’t have cap space to make any moves to add another backup. Yesterday, in his interview, chevy said the backup job was comrie’s to lose. That said, the above who said berdin is no good clearly hasn’t seen him play. He had a bit of a down year last year (very good middle half but slow start and tough finish) but he’s still very good.


And the Moose sucked so that doesn't help a goalies numbers much either.
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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 36
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Quoting: Jetman
Winnipeg is going for either Comrie or Berdin as their backup as we only have space for a 750K goalie...not a 3.5M one


Quoting: IconicHawk
Koskinen is way too f*cking expensive for the Jets to afford I’d go the cheaper route and play Berdin (I mean he would barely play any games because Hellebuyck is like a top 2 goalie in the nhl)


The Jets have exactly $13.87M in cap space: assuming a cushion of $1M,
-Logan Stanley can/should be bridged for no more than $1M as he doesn't have the GP to justify a substantial raise and lacks arbitration rights
-One of Niku or Heinola will start the season (at minimum) in the AHL
-Copp comes in at the $3.5M ballpark
-Pionk comes in at the $4M ballpark
-4 more sub-$1M forwards, assume an average of $800k
-Beaulieu's inclusion in the deal gives us an extra $1.25M to play with

This leaves the Jets with a maximum of $2.42M to spend on a backup goaltender. Little not coming off of LTIR over the course of the summer (if I remember correctly) may make his cap available for the Jets to spend before the start of the season. Worst case scenario the Jets can wait up to the first day of the season to sign Pionk and do a paper transaction with Heinola.

This trade works if Edmonton or another team retains another $600k. I can adjust the trade if you want but the more likely course of action is a third team retains that sub-league minimum amount (or more) on Koskinen at the Jets' expense. I suspect the cost to do so will be substantially less than during the deadline.

Quoting: arafay
The jets don’t have cap space to make any moves to add another backup. Yesterday, in his interview, chevy said the backup job was comrie’s to lose. That said, the above who said berdin is no good clearly hasn’t seen him play. He had a bit of a down year last year (very good middle half but slow start and tough finish) but he’s still very good.


Quoting: MisstheWhalers
Berdin is pretty good, I've watched a lot of Moose games and he looks solid, not sure if it'll transfer to the NHL but he's good at the AHL whether the numbers show it or not.


The transition from the AHL to the NHL is one of the hardest in sports. It typically takes KHL goaltenders to break the .920sv% mark to turn out to be league-average or slightly below it in the NHL. Berdin needs a run in the AHL, not even an entire season to be honest, of solid >.925sv% to justify his place on an NHL roster. It's simply a bad gamble otherwise.
29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 49
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Somehow I don't see the Oilers being able to dump Koskinen and get positive assets back. The only GM that might get suckered into doing that is Holland.
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29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 55
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Quoting: Windjammer
Somehow I don't see the Oilers being able to dump Koskinen and get positive assets back. The only GM that might get suckered into doing that is Holland.


To be fair, Beaulieu isn't a positive asset. smile
29 juill. 2021 à 13 h 57
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Quoting: Mr_Canoehead
To be fair, Beaulieu isn't a positive asset. smile


No but Reichel and the 5th are.happy
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29 juill. 2021 à 14 h 3
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Quoting: Windjammer
Somehow I don't see the Oilers being able to dump Koskinen and get positive assets back. The only GM that might get suckered into doing that is Holland.


Then quite frankly I don't think you understand NHL GMs nor do you understand what Koskinen is and having any discussion beyond that is going to be difficult.

Koskinen is a league-average goaltender that can happily take 1B minutes. The Oilers overworked him to start last season and the results were less than appealing. However, if you look at Koskinen's numbers when he isn't actively being run into the ground and he's even above league average. Is he overpaid? Absolutely. Awful? Not at all, you're just buying in to the verbal diarrhea of an unintelligent sect of the fanbase.

With retention, a b-prospect and a late pick is an adequate return. It should be higher but this trade reflects the 'optics' of acquiring Koskinen.
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29 juill. 2021 à 14 h 12
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Quoting: BeterChiarelli
Then quite frankly I don't think you understand NHL GMs nor do you understand what Koskinen is and having any discussion beyond that is going to be difficult.

Koskinen is a league-average goaltender that can happily take 1B minutes. The Oilers overworked him to start last season and the results were less than appealing. However, if you look at Koskinen's numbers when he isn't actively being run into the ground and he's even above league average. Is he overpaid? Absolutely. Awful? Not at all, you're just buying in to the verbal diarrhea of an unintelligent sect of the fanbase.

With retention, a b-prospect and a late pick is an adequate return. It should be higher but this trade reflects the 'optics' of acquiring Koskinen.


Alright. Clearly you view everything with a heavy Oiler bias. Koskinen is horrific, probably among the 3 or 4 worst goalies in the league with a sub 900 save percentage. I understand you're trying to troll everyone in this thread, but at least try to keep a tiny bit of realism in your posts.
29 juill. 2021 à 14 h 16
#21
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Khuldobin has the protection of a modified no trade clause in his contract, he can submit a 4-team no trade list and that might just be the biggest hurdle to overcome.

Setting that consideration aside, we do not know whether there was any interest in Koskinen among other NHL teams but we do know that the Oilers were interested in moving him but could not do so under terms that made sense to them. Given that, it seems to me that swapping Koskinen and a 2nd for Khuldobin, a B-prospect, and a 5th seems unlikely.

With that in mind, I suspect the Oilers might prefer to go with their current goaltending tandem to start the season. They tried to find a starter, it didn't happen so Oiler Management might hope that Koskinen gets it together. If he does, he certainly would not be the first player to have a strong showing playing out the final season of a contract. In the mean time, Tippett has proven adept at managing the workload shared by Smith and Koskinen, and with Stalock around he has some reasonable bench strength to fall back on if disaster strikes. Now, if injuries or consistent poor play force a move, Khuldonbin might be one of just a few options for the Oilers. A mid-season acquisition is unlikely to involve a third team, so the cost will be higher than fans would hope for.
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29 juill. 2021 à 14 h 34
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Quoting: Windjammer
Alright. Clearly you view everything with a heavy Oiler bias. Koskinen is horrific, probably among the 3 or 4 worst goalies in the league with a sub 900 save percentage. I understand you're trying to troll everyone in this thread, but at least try to keep a tiny bit of realism in your posts.


If we look to hockey-reference, over the span of January 13th to February 6th while Smith was hurt, Koskinen was an .889sv% goaltender. This was bad yes but also saw him play 12 games in 24 days, a workload he's not known to handle. Once Smith returned, over the span of February 9th to May 15th (13 games), Koskinen sported a 0.929sv%. Had it not been for Holland's inability to keep a goaltender to play with Koskinen, it's increasingly likely that both of Edmonton's goaltenders would have been in the Vezina conversation.

If we turn to naturalstattrick, over the past three seasons Koskinen has maintained a 0.916sv% (re: league average) at even-strength play. For goaltenders over this span that have played 1900min or more (such that there are 62 goalies to look at, two per team over this window) Koskinen ranks 43rd with that same save percentage ahead of names like Demko, Georgiev, Korpisalo, and Hart. If we assume that there are three tiers of goaltender - starter, tandem, and backup - with natural jenks every 20 some-odd goaltenders, Koskinen is either a poor man's tandem goaltender or the peak of backup netminders. This is the exact value I want to extract out of him.

I recognize that he's paid like a starter and cannot perform in that role. That's the point of the retention. He has ONE year left on his deal and I've shown that the Jets can make the cap work in a trade for Koskinen. What hasn't happened in this conversation is any rational sort of reply from any of Koskinen's detractors about how or why he "sucks". Koskinen is at minimum a league average goaltender who's only genuine downside is his cap hit.

It's not bias. It's not trolling. You simply don't have a point to make and resort to name-calling.
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29 juill. 2021 à 14 h 55
#23
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Quoting: BeterChiarelli
The Jets have exactly $13.87M in cap space: assuming a cushion of $1M,
-Logan Stanley can/should be bridged for no more than $1M as he doesn't have the GP to justify a substantial raise and lacks arbitration rights
-One of Niku or Heinola will start the season (at minimum) in the AHL
-Copp comes in at the $3.5M ballpark
-Pionk comes in at the $4M ballpark
-4 more sub-$1M forwards, assume an average of $800k
-Beaulieu's inclusion in the deal gives us an extra $1.25M to play with

This leaves the Jets with a maximum of $2.42M to spend on a backup goaltender. Little not coming off of LTIR over the course of the summer (if I remember correctly) may make his cap available for the Jets to spend before the start of the season. Worst case scenario the Jets can wait up to the first day of the season to sign Pionk and do a paper transaction with Heinola.

This trade works if Edmonton or another team retains another $600k. I can adjust the trade if you want but the more likely course of action is a third team retains that sub-league minimum amount (or more) on Koskinen at the Jets' expense. I suspect the cost to do so will be substantially less than during the deadline.





The transition from the AHL to the NHL is one of the hardest in sports. It typically takes KHL goaltenders to break the .920sv% mark to turn out to be league-average or slightly below it in the NHL. Berdin needs a run in the AHL, not even an entire season to be honest, of solid >.925sv% to justify his place on an NHL roster. It's simply a bad gamble otherwise.


Copp will be between 3.5(one year deal) and 4-4.5 on a long term...Pionk will be at 6M. Stanely will get around his qualifying(I agree with u). That is why Chevy already came out stating that Comrie and Berdin will be the backup
BeterChiarelli a aimé ceci.
29 juill. 2021 à 16 h 3
#24
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Quoting: BeterChiarelli
The Jets have exactly $13.87M in cap space: assuming a cushion of $1M,
-Logan Stanley can/should be bridged for no more than $1M as he doesn't have the GP to justify a substantial raise and lacks arbitration rights
-One of Niku or Heinola will start the season (at minimum) in the AHL
-Copp comes in at the $3.5M ballpark
-Pionk comes in at the $4M ballpark
-4 more sub-$1M forwards, assume an average of $800k
-Beaulieu's inclusion in the deal gives us an extra $1.25M to play with

This leaves the Jets with a maximum of $2.42M to spend on a backup goaltender. Little not coming off of LTIR over the course of the summer (if I remember correctly) may make his cap available for the Jets to spend before the start of the season. Worst case scenario the Jets can wait up to the first day of the season to sign Pionk and do a paper transaction with Heinola.

This trade works if Edmonton or another team retains another $600k. I can adjust the trade if you want but the more likely course of action is a third team retains that sub-league minimum amount (or more) on Koskinen at the Jets' expense. I suspect the cost to do so will be substantially less than during the deadline.





The transition from the AHL to the NHL is one of the hardest in sports. It typically takes KHL goaltenders to break the .920sv% mark to turn out to be league-average or slightly below it in the NHL. Berdin needs a run in the AHL, not even an entire season to be honest, of solid >.925sv% to justify his place on an NHL roster. It's simply a bad gamble otherwise.


Man, learn to take a no lol. Also, your estimations for Copp and pionk are terribly off. Pionk gets at least 6 (maybe in the 5.5-6 range if he takes a discount) and Copp gets at least 4 (again, unless he takes a discount). That leaves us literally with no room. Go try it in ACGM for yourself.

THE JETS DO NOT WANT KOSKINEN. They do not have a cap space: and if they wanted to get someone in that range, they would have Just resigned brossiot to the contract he got in Vegas (though I do think brossiot left because he wants a bigger role). Learn to take no for an answer.
29 juill. 2021 à 16 h 4
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Quoting: IconicHawk
Or meant to


Huh? Now I just feel stupid 😂
 
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