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I think Mark Stone is better than Elite

Créé par: yikes
Équipe: 2020-21 Équipe personnalisée
Date de création initiale: 20 avr. 2021
Publié: 20 avr. 2021
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
cap/ age/ contract doesn't matter

just the player versus player and what they bring presently

This is coming from a Sharks fan - I have no desire to see Vegas win a cup but I think Stone is unreal
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
36999 999 999 $273 991 236 $0 $0 $726 008 763 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
Logo de Rangers de New York
11 642 857 $11 642 857 $
AG
NMC
UFA - 6
Stone, Id Pick
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Golden Knights de Vegas
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
AD
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo de Capitals de Washington
9 538 462 $9 538 462 $
AG
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Stone, Id Pick
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Maple Leafs de Toronto
10 903 000 $10 903 000 $
AD
UFA - 5
Stone, Id Pick
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Sabres de Buffalo
10 000 000 $10 000 000 $
C
UFA - 6
Stone, Id Pick
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Blackhawks de Chicago
2 625 000 $2 625 000 $
AD
NMC
UFA - 3
Stone, Id Pick
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Avalanche du Colorado
6 300 000 $6 300 000 $
C
M-NTC
UFA - 3
almost even, honestly
800 000 $800 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
8 700 000 $8 700 000 $
C
NMC
UFA - 5
very, even
800 000 $800 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
8 500 000 $8 500 000 $
C, AG
UFA - 5
Stone, Id Pick
800 000 $800 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Maple Leafs de Toronto
11 640 250 $11 640 250 $
C
UFA - 4
very, even
800 000 $800 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
12 500 000 $12 500 000 $
C
UFA - 6
connor, obviously but its actually close
800 000 $800 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Bruins de Boston
6 666 667 $6 666 667 $
AD
UFA - 3
even, id say
800 000 $800 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
7 875 000 $7 875 000 $
DG
NMC
UFA - 5
even, id say
800 000 $800 000 $
Stone, Mark
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
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20 avr. 2021 à 18 h 25
#26
Banni
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I’m a huge fan of stone, but i just can’t do this with panarin. He’s such a freak. Since going to the rangers he’s third in points per game, just a hair behind McDavid and draisaitl. That kind of production, and a +54 in 103 games on a bad team is just ridiculous. I love everything about stone’s game, but I’m taking panarin all day.
20 avr. 2021 à 18 h 45
#27
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Quoting: Brad21
Wow. This is bad. You are overating Stone so badly it's not even funny.


Not really
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20 avr. 2021 à 18 h 46
#28
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Best winger in the NHL and a fringe top 5 player imo
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20 avr. 2021 à 18 h 58
#29
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C’mon almost evenwith MacKinnon look at what Stone does vs COL against what MacKinnon does vs VGK, then look at playoff performance MacKinnon 1.35ppg vs .78 for Stone. That’s not even close.
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20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 15
#30
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EklundCelebriniSmith
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Quoting: Brad21
Wow. This is bad. You are overating Stone so badly it's not even funny.


Ok what's your argument against him lol?
Quoting: Saskleaf
Is he really equal with Matthews, Mackinnon and Crosby though, all of whom were/are top 3 centres in the league?
Stone is great and is probably a top 3 winger in the whole league, but I don't think he should compared to the likes of Matthews, Crosby, Mackinnon.


Equal in what way; it matters on how you look at it.

Goal scoring

Matthews leads that list

Playmaking

McDavid leads that list

Speed

McDavid/ Mac

IQ?

Id say Stone or McDavid (McDavid 1, Stone 2)

Defence..

Stone by far

Takeaway abilties

Stone

Offence

McDavid or Matthews/ Draistial




Stone objectively is one of/ if not the best two way player in the league. Thats not subjective. (this is mainly too brad21)
He is a top two way forward. Let alone a top player in the league statistically (reference my comment with JFRESH TWITTER)

Add in the fact Stone is actually tied for 8th in league scoring, better defensively than all the players above him. I'd like to know how I'm overrating stone? when hes clearly Vegas's best player, and lead driver in both ends. And statistically over 14 million market value player for the stats he provides. And as i said in my other comments. You should use eye and stats together.
20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 16
#31
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EklundCelebriniSmith
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Quoting: Xqb15a
C’mon almost evenwith MacKinnon look at what Stone does vs COL against what MacKinnon does vs VGK, then look at playoff performance MacKinnon 1.35ppg vs .78 for Stone. That’s not even close.


I said almost even? Meaning Mackinnon is better. MacKinnon is a 1B to McDavid imo. Does not mean I can't give Stone some praise.
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20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 18
#32
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Stone is good but ur rating him way higher than you need to...
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20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 19
#33
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Quoting: mhockey91
Stone is good but ur rating him way higher than you need to...


I mean rating is subjective - but objectively idk how people can argue he's not fitting company of the names of the list if not better than some. Its not possible because objectively Stone is a top player in the league. Who you think is better is can be subjective when things get so close and involve intangibles/ bias. I believe Stone is a deserving name to be here and it's not like I think Stone is the best player in the world bar none. Because I believe that goes to McDavid then MacKinnon.
20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 20
#34
Pop Pop
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Best all around player in the game probably and just taken his game to another level in Vegas. You could argue hes better them all. Now if I had to start a team tomorrow would I pick him before mckinnon or mcdavid no probably not.
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20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 22
#35
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Quoting: Jfstompers
Best all around player in the game probably and just taken his game to another level in Vegas. You could argue hes better them all. Now if I had to start a team tomorrow would I pick him before mckinnon or mcdavid no probably not.


Yeah and I think this is where people are getting lost.

Im not saying stone is better than crosby for example.

Im saying currently - the HOF Crosby (one of the best of all time) does not bring much more to the table than Stone can CURRENTLY. McDavid and Mac are ahead - but I mean hes not miles behind and actually ahead of them in some categories. Stone is disrespected because he's not a household name.
20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 26
#36
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Modifié 20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 40
Quoting: CMcAvoy73
I’m a huge fan of stone, but i just can’t do this with panarin. He’s such a freak. Since going to the rangers he’s third in points per game, just a hair behind McDavid and draisaitl. That kind of production, and a +54 in 103 games on a bad team is just ridiculous. I love everything about stone’s game, but I’m taking panarin all day.


I like Panarin a lot. But Im valuing the player overall.

Panarin is a offensive weapon/ glass cannon. Hes not dog water defensively but hes outclassed defensively compared to Stone whos outclassed by Panarin offensively. Things this close do not mean I think Panarin is bad. I just think Stone is better. I think Stone is good enough offensively (hes really good) and way better defensively to the point where Stone outweighs Panarin imo.

The FOLLOWING is not literal it is a very rough example:

Stone = 9.5/10 defensively (no ones a 10)
8/10 offence

Panarin = 5-6.5/10 defensively (5 being average)
9.4/10 offence (mcdavid and leon would be a 9.5 for example)

As I said this is very very rough. But my point being - very few players are ahead of stone offensively (matthews, mac, mcd, pana, pasta etc are obvi ahead) but the point being stone is not just a 1 dimensional player. He's elite offensively and almost unmatched defensively. Matthews for example improved overall to the point where he could be seen as top 3 (mc, mac, matthews).

Matthews= 9.3-9.5/10 off
8 def

As I said; even imo.

Whereas someone like Crosby Is like a 9+/10 in both ends so with all of these players being so close its easy to go both ways but the point of the post (not just a comment for you but others) is that Stone has a case to be equal to or better than some of these players to be argued here.
20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 54
#37
NoWah49
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Stone is a beast, but he's no Sid, MacKinnon, Matthews.
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20 avr. 2021 à 19 h 59
#38
Banni
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Quoting: yikes
I like Panarin a lot. But Im valuing the player overall.

Panarin is a offensive weapon/ glass cannon. Hes not dog water defensively but hes outclassed defensively compared to Stone whos outclassed by Panarin offensively. Things this close do not mean I think Panarin is bad. I just think Stone is better. I think Stone is good enough offensively (hes really good) and way better defensively to the point where Stone outweighs Panarin imo.

The FOLLOWING is not literal it is a very rough example:

Stone = 9.5/10 defensively (no ones a 10)
8/10 offence

Panarin = 5-6.5/10 defensively (5 being average)
9.4/10 offence (mcdavid and leon would be a 9.5 for example)

As I said this is very very rough. But my point being - very few players are ahead of stone offensively (matthews, mac, mcd, pana, pasta etc are obvi ahead) but the point being stone is not just a 1 dimensional player. He's elite offensively and almost unmatched defensively. Matthews for example improved overall to the point where he could be seen as top 3 (mc, mac, matthews).

Matthews= 9.3-9.5/10 off
8 def

As I said; even imo.

Whereas someone like Crosby Is like a 9+/10 in both ends so with all of these players being so close its easy to go both ways but the point of the post (not just a comment for you but others) is that Stone has a case to be equal to or better than some of these players to be argued here.


Man, he’s just so dynamic. I just would have such a hard time not taking him. Such a game changer.
21 avr. 2021 à 0 h 23
#39
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Modifié 21 avr. 2021 à 0 h 33
Quoting: yikes
Ok what's your argument against him lol?

Equal in what way; it matters on how you look at it.

Goal scoring

Matthews leads that list

Playmaking

McDavid leads that list

Speed

McDavid/ Mac

IQ?

Id say Stone or McDavid (McDavid 1, Stone 2)

Defence..

Stone by far

Takeaway abilties

Stone

Offence

McDavid or Matthews/ Draistial




Stone objectively is one of/ if not the best two way player in the league. Thats not subjective. (this is mainly too brad21)
He is a top two way forward. Let alone a top player in the league statistically (reference my comment with JFRESH TWITTER)

Add in the fact Stone is actually tied for 8th in league scoring, better defensively than all the players above him. I'd like to know how I'm overrating stone? when hes clearly Vegas's best player, and lead driver in both ends. And statistically over 14 million market value player for the stats he provides. And as i said in my other comments. You should use eye and stats together.


Oh, I know Stone is great, one of the best 2 way forwards in the league (probably second to Bergeron, maybe even the best 2 way forward).
But Stone's offensive production is way behind all the players that are even to him according to you (aside from Hedman, and that doesn't count).
It's hard to compare them, because it's hard to compare stats, but I'd rather have the offensive powerhouses. And judging by what everyone else has said here, I'm not the only one who thinks this.
I'm not trying to say Stone shouldn't be considered as one of the league best (as in top 10 best). But he's not at the level that he should be compared to the leagues top 3 players. He's not quite that good.
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21 avr. 2021 à 3 h 26
#40
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Mark Stone is still underrated and this threads comments is proof. The guy is just an absolute beast at everything on the ice, and has literally never been anything short of very good. In my opinion, he was literally the best player in the entire NHL in the 18-19 season. The fact that the Jets did not want to send a package revolving around Roslovic and other parts for Stone haunts me to this day.
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21 avr. 2021 à 9 h 11
#41
exo2769
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I know I'm late to this party, but I agree with you. He's the new Marian Hossa. (Hossa did have 100 points in a season) Stone will be a HOFer IMO. The defensive side of the game is truly becoming a lost art. EVERYONE focuses soo much on player points that it's almost like they forget half the game is defense. It's scoring more points....than the other team. I'm a Hawks fan and I think the Hart SHOULD come down to either Stone or Kane. Saying that doesn't mean I won't take McDavid over Stone/Kane when putting together a team from scratch. It's just acknowledging what other players besides McDavid/MacKinnon have done in the NHL this year. Stone is amazing.
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22 avr. 2021 à 16 h 57
#42
sen krak fan
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Quoting: yikes
Ok what's your argument against him lol?

Equal in what way; it matters on how you look at it.

Goal scoring

Matthews leads that list

Playmaking

McDavid leads that list

Speed

McDavid/ Mac

IQ?

Id say Stone or McDavid (McDavid 1, Stone 2)

Defence..

Stone by far

Takeaway abilties

Stone

Offence

McDavid or Matthews/ Draistial




Stone objectively is one of/ if not the best two way player in the league. Thats not subjective. (this is mainly too brad21)
He is a top two way forward. Let alone a top player in the league statistically (reference my comment with JFRESH TWITTER)

Add in the fact Stone is actually tied for 8th in league scoring, better defensively than all the players above him. I'd like to know how I'm overrating stone? when hes clearly Vegas's best player, and lead driver in both ends. And statistically over 14 million market value player for the stats he provides. And as i said in my other comments. You should use eye and stats together.

He is good, but NOT EVEN CLOSE to as good as Mackinnon, Matthews, or Mcdavid. And just think. STONE IS A HART TROPHY CALIBER PLAYER!!!!!!
22 avr. 2021 à 16 h 58
#43
sen krak fan
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Quoting: exo2769
I know I'm late to this party, but I agree with you. He's the new Marian Hossa. (Hossa did have 100 points in a season) Stone will be a HOFer IMO. The defensive side of the game is truly becoming a lost art. EVERYONE focuses soo much on player points that it's almost like they forget half the game is defense. It's scoring more points....than the other team. I'm a Hawks fan and I think the Hart SHOULD come down to either Stone or Kane. Saying that doesn't mean I won't take McDavid over Stone/Kane when putting together a team from scratch. It's just acknowledging what other players besides McDavid/MacKinnon have done in the NHL this year. Stone is amazing.

Agreed but Stone should not win the hart.
22 avr. 2021 à 17 h 2
#44
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Quoting: bhavikp27
Yes


?
22 avr. 2021 à 17 h 46
#45
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Quoting: Brad21
?


Best winger in the league.
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22 avr. 2021 à 18 h 5
#46
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Quoting: exo2769
I know I'm late to this party, but I agree with you. He's the new Marian Hossa. (Hossa did have 100 points in a season) Stone will be a HOFer IMO. The defensive side of the game is truly becoming a lost art. EVERYONE focuses soo much on player points that it's almost like they forget half the game is defense. It's scoring more points....than the other team. I'm a Hawks fan and I think the Hart SHOULD come down to either Stone or Kane. Saying that doesn't mean I won't take McDavid over Stone/Kane when putting together a team from scratch. It's just acknowledging what other players besides McDavid/MacKinnon have done in the NHL this year. Stone is amazing.


Kane himself said McDavid should win the Hart.
22 avr. 2021 à 18 h 26
#47
exo2769
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Quoting: Saskleaf
Kane himself said McDavid should win the Hart.


And you're suggesting that McDavid would come out and say he should win it? That's not how it works. You don't vote yourself even if you deserve it. It's also what makes these guys...actual good people. I'd 100% take McDavid as my 1st choice if I were making a team. I just don't think we should discount everyone else's accomplishments. The Hart shouldn't be the most points every year.
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22 avr. 2021 à 21 h 2
#48
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Quoting: exo2769
And you're suggesting that McDavid would come out and say he should win it? That's not how it works. You don't vote yourself even if you deserve it. It's also what makes these guys...actual good people. I'd 100% take McDavid as my 1st choice if I were making a team. I just don't think we should discount everyone else's accomplishments. The Hart shouldn't be the most points every year.


Oh, I don't disagree. I think it's important to acknowledge other players other than just McDavid, and no, I'm not saying McDavid would say he's going win the Hart, but he's also probably not going to say Kane should win the hart either. Do other player deserve to get serious Hart consideration? Yes. Will they? No.
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23 avr. 2021 à 10 h 6
#49
sen krak fan
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Quoting: exo2769
And you're suggesting that McDavid would come out and say he should win it? That's not how it works. You don't vote yourself even if you deserve it. It's also what makes these guys...actual good people. I'd 100% take McDavid as my 1st choice if I were making a team. I just don't think we should discount everyone else's accomplishments. The Hart shouldn't be the most points every year.


I know! Now It's like whoever wins the Art Ross wins the Hart aswell.
 
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