The all possession team, measured by RELATIVE CORSI ratings (how much more possession does a team have when that player is on ice).
(guys you want to build a team around)
(Stats for 2020-21 season, minimum 30 games played)
----
Definitions:
"Relative Corsi” (CF% Rel or SAT% Rel): Shows the relative effect of a player on the ice. A positive CF% Rel means that when the player is on the ice, the team’s CF% is higher than when the player is not on the ice.
relative corsi is kinda flawed imo, it favours top players on teams with no depth and players who get overused on offense when the rest of his team is used in more defensive situations
He has been so much better! 41GP, 9G, 12A, 21P. Last year he got 21 points In like 60 some games. He needs to practice his face off ability, because 36% is horrible for a top 6 center man.
relative corsi is kinda flawed imo, it favours top players on teams with no depth and players who get overused on offense when the rest of his team is used in more defensive situations
Its not relative to one player (or line), but to a whole team, so it does smooth out most of the situational noise.
And all but 5 of these guys are on playoff teams, so 'top players on bad team' is not really fitting.
He has been so much better! 41GP, 9G, 12A, 21P. Last year he got 21 points In like 60 some games. He needs to practice his face off ability, because 36% is horrible for a top 6 center man.
I agree. He is brutal on faceoffs. But he has been getting better
Its not relative to one player (or line), but to a whole team
Exactly, guys like Jost/Nichushkin have low (and even negative) relative corsi despite having 57.4% and 61.8% CF% at even strength because they take more defensive matchups for their team and the team as a whole has good possession numbers. Meanwhile guys on DET (and former DET players) like Hronek and Mantha have high relative corsi even with only 50.1% and 49.6% CF% at even strength because they take more offensive minutes and the rest of their teammates have/had bad possesion numbers.
Makes no sense to make it relative to their team (especially when different teams have drastically different baseline averages that you are comparing to) instead of being relative to a replacement level player like other stats like WAR tries to do
Quoting: NHLfan10506
so it does smooth out most of the situational noise.
Thats the opposite of what it does. making it relative to the whole team exaggerates the effects of a certain player who takes significantly more offensive or defensive minutes relative to his teammates. It may average out for players who get balanced minutes relative to their teams, but for guys like Yandle who have crazy high oZS% relative to his team it makes a huge difference when you compare his CF% when on the ice to when hes off the ice when the team generally uses players like Gudas in those defensive situations more often.
Quoting: NHLfan10506
And all but 5 of these guys are on playoff teams, so 'top players on bad team' is not really fitting.
Doesnt have to be a bad team, just "bad depth", or very unbalanced teams like EDM where there is a huge skill/usage difference between McDavid/Drai and their bottom 6. Obviously McDavid and Draisaitl are going to have high relative corsi numbers when you compare them to guys like Gaetan Haas and Zack Kassian. The effects of McDavid and Drai's possession is very exaggerated since it is being compared to a much lower standard than guys like Svechnikov who play on much deeper teams
I dunno ... he is equal parts amazing and frustrating to watch. His vision/anticipation, passing & skating are otherworldly... but the 19 year old, sloppy, giveaways are so frustrating. I understand chances need to be taken to produce the spectacular, but I look forward to a more mature playing style in the future. The mistakes are just too costly if/when the playoffs (one day) come along.
The compete and drive are obviously there. Time is on his side & I believe he will not be under-rated for long ... but the giveaways need to stop.
Hischier / Hughes definitely looks bright. Great change up/complimentary styles.
I dunno ... he is equal parts amazing and frustrating to watch. His vision/anticipation, passing & skating are otherworldly... but the 19 year old, sloppy, giveaways are so frustrating. I understand chances need to be taken to produce the spectacular, but I look forward to a more mature playing style in the future. The mistakes are just too costly if/when the playoffs (one day) come along.
The compete and drive are obviously there. Time is on his side & I believe he will not be under-rated for long ... but the giveaways need to stop.
Hischier / Hughes definitely looks bright. Great change up/complimentary styles.
I agree. The giveaways are annoying. He leads the league in giveaways per game, but you got to remember. He's only 19. And he is the center of the whole Devils offense. Almost all of the defenses in the East are pretty good and focus their game plan to stop Hughes. This would lead to turnovers which is understandable. As Hughes grows as a player and gets better linemates (Holtz and Foote/Mercer), he would reduce his turnovers
I agree. The giveaways are annoying. He leads the league in giveaways per game, but you got to remember. He's only 19. And he is the center of the whole Devils offense. Almost all of the defenses in the East are pretty good and focus their game plan to stop Hughes. This would lead to turnovers which is understandable. As Hughes grows as a player and gets better linemates (Holtz and Foote/Mercer), he would reduce his turnovers
He doesn't have a choice, if winning is important to him.
I dunno ... he is equal parts amazing and frustrating to watch. His vision/anticipation, passing & skating are otherworldly... but the 19 year old, sloppy, giveaways are so frustrating. I understand chances need to be taken to produce the spectacular, but I look forward to a more mature playing style in the future. The mistakes are just too costly if/when the playoffs (one day) come along.
The compete and drive are obviously there. Time is on his side & I believe he will not be under-rated for long ... but the giveaways need to stop.
Hischier / Hughes definitely looks bright. Great change up/complimentary styles.
Quoting: Devil1122
I agree. The giveaways are annoying. He leads the league in giveaways per game, but you got to remember. He's only 19. And he is the center of the whole Devils offense. Almost all of the defenses in the East are pretty good and focus their game plan to stop Hughes. This would lead to turnovers which is understandable. As Hughes grows as a player and gets better linemates (Holtz and Foote/Mercer), he would reduce his turnovers
His giveaways/takeaways are nearly identical to Marner’s. As the team develops around him, the chances will turn into points.
It’s like food groups.
Too much of one of them is bad.
But you need a bit of all of them.
Well, usually someone use them here, it's for nit-picking, isolating one stat that fit their narrative, because no meaningfull debate can happen when someone throws numbers around.
Well, usually someone use them here, it's for nit-picking, isolating one stat that fit their narrative, because no meaningfull debate can happen when someone throws numbers around.
Just one piece of the puzzle.
Especially for us amateur GMs.
"In terms of advanced numbers, Hughes has been a possession driver and shot generator with a team-best 58.6 Corsi-For percentage, a +8.9 percent Corsi-For relative to his teammates, and the second-most shot attempts (180). Holding onto the puck as often as Hughes does has its drawbacks, as his 44 giveaways at 5-on-5 is the second most among all NHL forwards (with Toronto star Mitch Marner being first, by the way). Another concern is the fact that he leads the team with 2:54 of power-play time a game, yet the Devils are an abysmal 29th in scoring during the man advantage."
@Opie@Devil1122 He took my post almost word for word...even the point about Marner! Haha.
Thanks Steve.
I agree with this. Hughes is so good at getting possession and generating plays, however when he holds onto the puck for too long, he turns the puck over. He needs to learn when to shoot instead of trying to make a play. Take for example the Rangers game. If Hughes didn't play we would have gotten blown out. Without Hughes on the ice, we got out shot greatly. But we couldn't score because we didn't get many quality chances. Hughes needs start shooting more. I like what Sharangovich does, he enters the zone and shoots
I agree with this. Hughes is so good at getting possession and generating plays, however when he holds onto the puck for too long, he turns the puck over. He needs to learn when to shoot instead of trying to make a play. Take for example the Rangers game. If Hughes didn't play we would have gotten blown out. Without Hughes on the ice, we got out shot greatly. But we couldn't score because we didn't get many quality chances. Hughes needs start shooting more. I like what Sharangovich does, he enters the zone and shoots
Yeah, love Sharangovich’s game right now. He has one long wrist shot with power and another quick release one.
I am ok with the amount of turnovers Hughes is giving up, because he has the puck on his stick longer than anyone in NHL (with 4-5 exceptions). And he is among league leaders in takeaways too.
Nhl_oilers a aimé ceci.
Répondre
CapFriendly
CapFriendly