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What the Predators asked from the Jets for Ekholm

Créé par: sensonfire
Équipe: 2020-21 Jets de Winnipeg
Date de création initiale: 6 avr. 2021
Publié: 6 avr. 2021
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
According to Darren Dreger, Nashville wanted a 1st, Ville Heinola and something else for Ekholm.

The Jets said no.

I felt they made the right decision.

Heinola is a blue chip prospect who might become a greater defenceman than Ekholm.

David Poile was obviously "way in over his head".

The fact that Poile had the audacity to also ask for a 1st in addition to Heinola is a sign of greed for a team that was getting desperate not too long ago.

IMO, Nashville should keep Ekholm and hold down that last playoff spot in the Central Division.

Let me know your thoughts and I'll see you in the comments :D
Transactions
NSH
  1. Heinola, Ville
  2. Choix de 1e ronde en 2021 (WPG)
Détails additionnels:
plus something else.

Whatever that means :/
Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
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6 avr. 2021 à 19 h 46
#1
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Ekholm will still be valuable next season, whats the rush? Sell Haula, Granlund, etc. Picks next year will be more valuable anyway. Dallas is going to catch NSH but it will be close. Either way, Dallas won't be going far this year I suspect and NSH won't either unless Rinne carries them at 38yrs old..
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6 avr. 2021 à 19 h 51
#2
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So basically Nashville highballed and Winnipeg lowballed. I could see them calling eachother again and agreeing on Samberg and a 1st
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6 avr. 2021 à 19 h 57
#3
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Nashville doesn’t have to move him and Poile knows it. He’s gonna ask for something that’s probably unrealistic and if someone bites then he will be ecstatic
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6 avr. 2021 à 19 h 57
#4
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Nashville is in a playoff race right now, so the incentive for Poile is to wait on trading Ekholm until the offseason unless he gets an outstanding offer.
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 7
#5
KFTW
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Quoting: PeterK
Ekholm will still be valuable next season, whats the rush? Sell Haula, Granlund, etc. Picks next year will be more valuable anyway. Dallas is going to catch NSH but it will be close. Either way, Dallas won't be going far this year I suspect and NSH won't either unless Rinne carries them at 38yrs old..


Expansion. They don’t want to protect 4 and 4
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 13
#6
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I cannot imagine he would go for less...especially now since Nashville is in playoff picture
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 13
#7
wpg
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Heinola straight up is a easy dealbreaker

By the looks of it Poile is high balling everyone and will make the asking price lower and lower till someone bites
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 16
#8
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Niku + Vesalainen + 1st is max they should pay
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 20
#9
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Could you explain what you mean by "David Poile was obviously "way in over his head"." @sensonfire? That statement doesn't make much sense to me. It seems to imply that Poile either got ripped off (which didn't happen, as he hasn't made a trade) or that he's inexperienced (obviously not the case).

I don't think you can call him audacious or greedy for setting a high price for Ekholm. Poile has a valuable player he isn't at risk of losing for nothing. He can set whatever price he likes - if he can't get what he wants in return, he'd be foolish to sell right now.

When the Avs were in the basement in 16-17, Sakic was getting heat for not moving Duchene. He waited and waited until the next season was already underway before he found his price. His patience was rewarded - he got a huge haul that will help the Avs for the next decade.
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 27
#10
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Quoting: gmgb
Could you explain what you mean by "David Poile was obviously "way in over his head"." sensonfire? That statement doesn't make much sense to me. It seems to imply that Poile either got ripped off (which didn't happen, as he hasn't made a trade) or that he's inexperienced (obviously not the case).

I don't think you can call him audacious or greedy for setting a high price for Ekholm. Poile has a valuable player he isn't at risk of losing for nothing. He can set whatever price he likes - if he can't get what he wants in return, he'd be foolish to sell right now.

When the Avs were in the basement in 16-17, Sakic was getting heat for not moving Duchene. He waited and waited until the next season was already underway before he found his price. His patience was rewarded - he got a huge haul that will help the Avs for the next decade.


Exactly. Poile is honestly in a pretty good situation right now with Ekholm. There's no reason for him to sell low on him with NSH being back in the playoff picture. One of two things will happen: Ekholm gets traded for a big package in the next week or NSH keeps him and makes a playoff push and can revisit this in the offseason. There isn’t any rush at all to sell now.
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 27
#11
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Quoting: gmgb
Could you explain what you mean by "David Poile was obviously "way in over his head"." sensonfire? That statement doesn't make much sense to me. It seems to imply that Poile either got ripped off (which didn't happen, as he hasn't made a trade) or that he's inexperienced (obviously not the case).

I don't think you can call him audacious or greedy for setting a high price for Ekholm. Poile has a valuable player he isn't at risk of losing for nothing. He can set whatever price he likes - if he can't get what he wants in return, he'd be foolish to sell right now.

When the Avs were in the basement in 16-17, Sakic was getting heat for not moving Duchene. He waited and waited until the next season was already underway before he found his price. His patience was rewarded - he got a huge haul that will help the Avs for the next decade.


The difference from the Avs situation is that Poile may want to protect 7-3-1 instead of 4-4-1 ahead of the expansion draft. While I agree Poile shouldn't be in any rush to deal in the midst of a playoff push, he doesn't even have a full offseason to make a trade once his season ends.
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 29
#12
AA21
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I would be concerned if he wasn't initially asking for Heinola, NSH should be receiving a blue chip prospect for a player like Ekholm, not to mention he has a year and a half of control on a cheap contract.
A first round pick holds lesser value this season, historically weak draft class with some prospects not skating and limited travel for scouts.

Its also (likely) Poile's last season as GM, if hes moving one of their top defensemen before the playoffs he needs the return to be a haul.

Note: I'd prefer a forward prospect over defensemen, NSH has multiple D prospects ready for a shot at NHL
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 43
#13
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Quoting: Mr_Canoehead
The difference from the Avs situation is that Poile may want to protect 7-3-1 instead of 4-4-1 ahead of the expansion draft. While I agree Poile shouldn't be in any rush to deal in the midst of a playoff push, he doesn't even have a full offseason to make a trade once his season ends.


Expansion protection isn't a huge issue for NSH right now. There really aren't seven "must protect" forwards currently on the team.

Quoting: AnalyticalGM
I would be concerned if he wasn't initially asking for Heinola, NSH should be receiving a blue chip prospect for a player like Ekholm, not to mention he has a year and a half of control on a cheap contract.
A first round pick holds lesser value this season, historically weak draft class with some prospects not skating and limited travel for scouts.

Its also (likely) Poile's last season as GM, if hes moving one of their top defensemen before the playoffs he needs the return to be a haul.

Note: I'd prefer a forward prospect over defensemen, NSH has multiple D prospects ready for a shot at NHL


I strongly agree about preferring a forward prospect. The Preds have Josi and Ellis locked up long term, the immediate future on the back end got showcased for us this year and Fabbro, Carrier, Allard, & Davies all looked like a solid group. Farrance is just around the corner, and the next couple drafts are supposed to be loaded with defensemen. The backend shouldn't be NSH's priority right now.
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6 avr. 2021 à 20 h 50
#14
wpg
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Quoting: AnalyticalGM
I would be concerned if he wasn't initially asking for Heinola, NSH should be receiving a blue chip prospect for a player like Ekholm, not to mention he has a year and a half of control on a cheap contract.
A first round pick holds lesser value this season, historically weak draft class with some prospects not skating and limited travel for scouts.

Its also (likely) Poile's last season as GM, if hes moving one of their top defensemen before the playoffs he needs the return to be a haul.

Note: I'd prefer a forward prospect over defensemen, NSH has multiple D prospects ready for a shot at NHL


NSH isn’t getting a blue chip prospect

1: he isn’t worth it,
2: Expansion draft... whoever gets Ekholm could lose a really good impact player to Seattle, let’s say Jets if we get Ekholm we stand to lose a strong player in our lineup... that alone is going to negate a lot of contending teams that could stand to lose more then they get
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6 avr. 2021 à 21 h 1
#15
Démarrer sujet
sensonfire
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Modifié 6 avr. 2021 à 21 h 9
Quoting: gmgb
Could you explain what you mean by "David Poile was obviously "way in over his head"." @sensonfire? That statement doesn't make much sense to me. It seems to imply that Poile either got ripped off (which didn't happen, as he hasn't made a trade) or that he's inexperienced (obviously not the case).

I don't think you can call him audacious or greedy for setting a high price for Ekholm. Poile has a valuable player he isn't at risk of losing for nothing. He can set whatever price he likes - if he can't get what he wants in return, he'd be foolish to sell right now.

When the Avs were in the basement in 16-17, Sakic was getting heat for not moving Duchene. He waited and waited until the next season was already underway before he found his price. His patience was rewarded - he got a huge haul that will help the Avs for the next decade.


Being "in over your head" is a colloquial expression that can mean "getting carried away" or becoming so deeply involved and ambitious that you lost control of the situation.

Poile got carried away and lost control over negotiating with Chevaldayoff on what to do about Ekholm when he asked for Heinola + a 1st.

If anything, Poile was trying to fleece the Jets, not the other way around.

Poile has been a GM in the NHL for 40 years and he should know better.


I have stated in the past and other credible sources have indicated in the past what David Poile was asking for in exchange for Ekholm, which serves as the benchmark for an Ekholm trade.

It is a return similar to what the Kings got for Jake Muzzin.

Other teams should know what the actual price is for Ekholm and Poile should know it too.

The fact that Nashville is no longer in the basement and is actually holding down the last playoff spot in the Central division doesn't change what Ekholm is worth.

At all.


I think Ekholm is a borderline elite defenceman in the NHL who should command a significant return but Poile needs to be more honest about Ekholm is worth.

The fact that we went from a Muzzin-esque return for Ekholm to Heinola + a 1st + "something else" is disingenuous to say the least.

The fact that the Preds are now all of a sudden competing for a playoff spot should not excuse how flustered and greedy David Poile has become at this time of year.


Just my two cents smile
6 avr. 2021 à 21 h 5
#16
AA21
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Quoting: HockeyFan989
NSH isn’t getting a blue chip prospect

1: he isn’t worth it,
2: Expansion draft... whoever gets Ekholm could lose a really good impact player to Seattle, let’s say Jets if we get Ekholm we stand to lose a strong player in our lineup... that alone is going to negate a lot of contending teams that could stand to lose more then they get


So maybe we should put the Ekholm to WPG rumours to bed, doesnt sound worth it
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6 avr. 2021 à 21 h 12
#17
wpg
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Quoting: AnalyticalGM
So maybe we should put the Ekholm to WPG rumours to bed, doesnt sound worth it


Honestly it isn’t worth it at all

Unless NSH significantly reduces their asking price which they’re going to cause nobody’s paying that

But hey! U can always keep him, go 4-4-1 in the draft and lose a good forwardsmile
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6 avr. 2021 à 21 h 16
#18
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Quoting: HockeyFan989
Honestly it isn’t worth it at all

Unless NSH significantly reduces their asking price which they’re going to cause nobody’s paying that

But hey! U can always keep him, go 4-4-1 in the draft and lose a good forwardsmile


I mean if NSH had 5 forwards to protect i'd understand ur logic
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6 avr. 2021 à 21 h 26
#19
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Quoting: sensonfire
Being "in over your head" is a colloquial expression that can mean "getting carried away" or becoming so deeply involved and ambitious that you lost control of the situation.

Poile got carried away and lost control over negotiating with Chevaldayoff on what to do about Ekholm when he asked for Heinola + a 1st.

Poile has been a GM in the NHL for 40 years and he should know better.


I have stated in the past and other credible sources have indicated in the past what David Poile was asking for in exchange for Ekholm, which serves as the benchmark for an Ekholm trade.

It is a return similar to what the Kings got for Jake Muzzin.

Other teams should know what the actual price is for Ekholm and Poile should know it too.

The fact that Nashville is no longer in the basement and is actually holding down the last playoff spot in the Central division doesn't change what Ekholm is worth.

At all.


I think Ekholm is a borderline elite defenceman in the NHL who should command a significant return but Poile needs to be more honest about Ekholm is worth.

The fact that we went from a Muzzin-esque return for Ekholm to Heinola + a 1st + "something else" is disingenuous to say the least.

The fact that the Preds are now all of a sudden competing for a playoff spot should not excuse how flustered and greedy David Poile has become at this time of year.


Just my two cents smile


Thanks for taking the time to explain. I'm familiar with the expression, but I don't feel it was used in the correct context. That was what led to my confusion. Regardless, I understand your position more now. I can't say I agree with it TBH, but we're all entitled to our opinions and I respect you for articulating yours.

My biggest sticking point when the Muzzin trade is used as a comparable for an Ekholm trade is that the prospects LA received haven't amounted to much so far. At the time, they were both recent 2nd round picks and obviously LA saw potential there. Because neither of them have shown much since the trade, everyone seems to peg Ekholm's value as a 1st and two pieces of no consequence (long shot prospects, minor cap dumps, 24 yr old fringe NHLers, etc). That isn't what LA traded for though, and Poile shouldn't settle for that type of return just because the internet wants him to make a trade. As I said earlier, there's no downside with him being patient. If the market is down because GMs are scared about the expansion draft, he can afford to wait until after that. Ekholm would be a top pairing defenseman on most teams, if not their #1 - WPG included. Poile shouldn't trade a player of his caliber for scraps, just for the sake of making a trade.
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7 avr. 2021 à 12 h 38
#20
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Quoting: csick
Niku + Vesalainen + 1st is max they should pay


Agreed. To me Heinola and Samberg are off the table.
If I was Nashville i wouldve asked for Heinola, a first plus plus too. Like it's been said already, Poile doesnt need to move him unless someone blows him away...jets shouldnt be blowing anyone
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