Forums/Armchair-GM

Just thinking about something a bit different

Créé par: Anus_McLeod
Date de création initiale: mar 23, 2021
Publié: 23 mar à 13 h 33
Équipe: 2020-21 Avalanche du Colorado
Explications
Not too sure about the trade (tempted to have Colorado include a 3rd or something) but all of a sudden became intrigued by Ekholm. Guessing this doesn't make sense to most, but damn does that D look insane and more playoff ready. Also figured it would be something to discuss.
Transactions
COL
  1. Ekholm, Mattias (1 750 000 $ retained)
NSH
  1. Compher, J.T.
  2. Timmins, Conor
  3. Kaut, Martin
Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
  • Ian Cole: 800 000 $ (19%)
ANNÉE DE REPÊCHAGERONDE 1RONDE 2RONDE 3RONDE 4RONDE 5RONDE 6RONDE 7
2021
COL
COL
COL
COL
2022
COL
COL
COL
COL
COL
COL
2023
COL
COL
COL
COL
COL
COL
COL
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS BONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2281 500 000 $71 695 554 $0 $5 000 000 $9 804 446 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
COL
Landeskog, Gabriel
5 571 429 $
AG, C
NTC
UFA - 1
COL
MacKinnon, Nathan
6 300 000 $
C, AD
NTC
UFA - 3
COL
Rantanen, Mikko
9 250 000 $
AD
UFA - 5
COL
Saad, Brandon
5 000 000 $
AD, AG
NTC
UFA - 1
COL
Kadri, Nazem
4 500 000 $
C
NTC
UFA - 2
COL
Burakovsky, André
4 900 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 2
COL
Nichushkin, Valeri
2 500 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 2
COL
Jost, Tyson
874 125 $
C, AG, AD
RFA - 1
COL
Donskoi, Joonas
3 900 000 $
AD
UFA - 3
COL
Calvert, Matt
2 850 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 1
COL
Bellemare, Pierre-Édouard
1 800 000 $
C, AG
UFA - 1
COL
O'Connor, Logan
725 000 $
AD
RFA - 2
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
COL
Toews, Devon
4 100 000 $
DG
UFA - 4
COL
Makar, Cale
880 833 $
DD
RFA - 1
COL
Grubauer, Philipp
3 333 333 $
G
UFA - 1
NSH
Ekholm, Mattias
2 000 000 $
DG
UFA - 2
COL
Girard, Samuel
5 000 000 $
DG
UFA - 7
COL
Johansson, Jonas
700 000 $
G
UFA - 1
COL
Byram, Bowen
894 167 $
DG
RFA - 3
COL
Graves, Ryan
3 166 667 $
DG
UFA - 3
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
COL
MacDonald, Jacob
725 000 $
DG
UFA - 2
COL
Johnson, Erik
6 000 000 $
DD
NMC NTC
UFA - 3
COL
Sherwood, Kiefer
750 000 $
AD, C
RFA - 1
COL
Francouz, Pavel
2 000 000 $
G
UFA - 2
Équipe de réserve
COL
Pateryn, Greg
2 250 000 $ (1 175 000 $)
DD
UFA - 1
COL
Werner, Adam
842 500 $ (0 $)
G
RFA - 1
COL
Renouf, Daniel
700 000 $ (0 $)
DG
UFA - 1
COL
Megna, Jayson
700 000 $ (0 $)
AD
UFA - 1

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23 mar à 13 h 37
#1
Leafs and Jets
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Seattle would love you for this. The avs are already going to go Seattle a top pairing defenseman for them, this makes things even better.
TJTwolf a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 13 h 39
#2
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It looks nice on paper for sure, but the ask would be two good prospects PLUS a 1st, so you need to add a 1st to that offer, especially if you account for Compher.

As mentioned by the poster above it would also create problems in the expansion draft.
Lenny7, villenash et TJTwolf a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 13 h 45
#3
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Quoting: Saskleaf
Seattle would love you for this. The avs are already going to go Seattle a top pairing defenseman for them, this makes things even better.


Quoting: Richard88
It looks nice on paper for sure, but the ask would be two good prospects PLUS a 1st, so you need to add a 1st to that offer, especially if you account for Compher.

As mentioned by the poster above it would also create problems in the expansion draft.


Meh, not concerned about the xdraft. They'll still end up with Graves unless they opt for one single season of Ekholm.

In terms of compensation, two xdraft prospects and a roster player seems comparable to the Muzzin trade. Timmins and Kaut are both better than what LA got (imo). Like I said above though, tempted to add a third (not first).
23 mar à 13 h 49
#4
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Quoting: Anus_McLeod
Meh, not concerned about the xdraft. They'll still end up with Graves unless they opt for one single season of Ekholm.

In terms of compensation, two xdraft prospects and a roster player seems comparable to the Muzzin trade. Timmins and Kaut are both better than what LA got (imo). Like I said above though, tempted to add a third (not first).


Compher isn't comparable to a 1st at all. I'd much rather have a 1st.
Saskleaf et Lenny7 a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 13 h 50
#5
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Quoting: Anus_McLeod
Meh, not concerned about the xdraft. They'll still end up with Graves unless they opt for one single season of Ekholm.

In terms of compensation, two xdraft prospects and a roster player seems comparable to the Muzzin trade. Timmins and Kaut are both better than what LA got (imo). Like I said above though, tempted to add a third (not first).


Will Erik Johnson really waive though? Not something I'd count on (he could, but he probably wants to stay). Colorado is going to be to Seattle what Flordia was to Vegas, mark my words.
gmgb a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 13 h 56
#6
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Quoting: Anus_McLeod
Meh, not concerned about the xdraft. They'll still end up with Graves unless they opt for one single season of Ekholm.

In terms of compensation, two xdraft prospects and a roster player seems comparable to the Muzzin trade. Timmins and Kaut are both better than what LA got (imo). Like I said above though, tempted to add a third (not first).


You'd be paying the price for 2 playoff runs of Ekholm, but only getting him for 1 year. Unless you can guarantee that EJ waives AND going 4+4 and lose Burakovsky. It's just not worth it given that Avs already have the best D in the league.

Ekholm is better than Muzzin. And on a sweet contract.
TJTwolf a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 13 h 56
#7
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Quoting: Saskleaf
Will Erik Johnson really waive though? Not something I'd count on (he could, but he probably wants to stay). Colorado is going to be to Seattle what Flordia was to Vegas, mark my words.


EJ will either waive or get bought out. No way does Sakic expose on of Makar, Girard, or Toews.
TJTwolf a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 13 h 57
#8
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Quoting: gmgb
Compher isn't comparable to a 1st at all. I'd much rather have a 1st.


I'm not saying Compher is equal to a first. I'm saying that overall it's close to the value in the Muzzun trade. Kaut and Timmins are good prospects and xdraft exempt. They are low risk too. But fair enough.
TJTwolf a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 13 h 59
#9
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Quoting: Richard88
EJ will either waive or get bought out. No way does Sakic expose on of Makar, Girard, or Toews.


But you still lose Graves. And if you go 4-4, you lose either the right to Landy (Seattle could give him a massive contract and get themselves a franchise player), Kadri, or Burakovski. Likely Graves becomes Seattle's best defenseman.
23 mar à 14 h 00
#10
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Quoting: Anus_McLeod
I'm not saying Compher is equal to a first. I'm saying that overall it's close to the value in the Muzzun trade. Kaut and Timmins are good prospects and xdraft exempt. They are low risk too. But fair enough.


NSH isn't getting a 1st (which would be the main piece in an Ekholm return), they're taking on an undesirable contract, and retaining salary. Sorry, but I don't think it's close for NSH at all.
23 mar à 14 h 04
#11
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Quoting: Richard88
You'd be paying the price for 2 playoff runs of Ekholm, but only getting him for 1 year. Unless you can guarantee that EJ waives AND going 4+4 and lose Burakovsky. It's just not worth it given that Avs already have the best D in the league.

Ekholm is better than Muzzin. And on a sweet contract.


I'd feel a lot better about Ekholm than MacDonald in the playoffs. It's especially important if Johnson is done for the year. Also consider that any other team trading for Ekholm creates the same expansion draft issue. Timmins, Kaut, Compher, and a third is not bad (imo).

In the end I probably don't do this. I'm intrigued though.
23 mar à 14 h 06
#12
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Quoting: Saskleaf
But you still lose Graves. And if you go 4-4, you lose either the right to Landy (Seattle could give him a massive contract and get themselves a franchise player), Kadri, or Burakovski. Likely Graves becomes Seattle's best defenseman.


You won't find many Avs fans fretting about losing Graves to Seattle. Losing him would be fine, and would give us some cap flexibility going forwards. Avs are going to lose a decent player regardless.
TJTwolf a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 14 h 07
#13
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Quoting: Anus_McLeod
I'd feel a lot better about Ekholm than MacDonald in the playoffs. It's especially important if Johnson is done for the year. Also consider that any other team trading for Ekholm creates the same expansion draft issue. Timmins, Kaut, Compher, and a third is not bad (imo).

In the end I probably don't do this. I'm intrigued though.


Other teams who lack top 3 Dmen would beat that offer pretty easily.
Saskleaf et TJTwolf a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 14 h 16
#14
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Quoting: Richard88
Other teams who lack top 3 Dmen would beat that offer pretty easily.


I'm not sure anyone looking to make trades now would be in that spot. Maybe Winnipeg. I'm not sure they beat the offer though. Maybe they give up their first, but what's more valuable today, a guy in Timmins or Kaut that has shown at the NHL level, or a first in a draft you can't scout like you want to due to the pandemic?

Maybe I'm off, but I think it's a decent offer and comparable to the Muzzin trade.
23 mar à 14 h 26
#15
Leafs and Jets
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Quoting: Richard88
You won't find many Avs fans fretting about losing Graves to Seattle. Losing him would be fine, and would give us some cap flexibility going forwards. Avs are going to lose a decent player regardless.


Ya, I know. But when losing a guy like Ryan Graves is a best case scenario (which I agree it would be), you're in trouble.
23 mar à 14 h 30
#16
Leafs and Jets
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Quoting: Anus_McLeod
I'm not sure anyone looking to make trades now would be in that spot. Maybe Winnipeg. I'm not sure they beat the offer though. Maybe they give up their first, but what's more valuable today, a guy in Timmins or Kaut that has shown at the NHL level, or a first in a draft you can't scout like you want to due to the pandemic?

Maybe I'm off, but I think it's a decent offer and comparable to the Muzzin trade.


An offer of, for example, Stanley, Niku and a first easily beats this.
Or Lauzon, Lohrei and a first
Or Sandin, Ratcliffe and a first

Just a few examples.
23 mar à 14 h 53
#17
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Quoting: Saskleaf
An offer of, for example, Stanley, Niku and a first easily beats this.
Or Lauzon, Lohrei and a first
Or Sandin, Ratcliffe and a first

Just a few examples.


We'll see what he ultimately goes for (if he goes), but it sounds like teams aren't valuing late 2021 firsts very highly (they probably are 2022 firsts though), so I'm not counting on a lot of first rounders being moved.

Lauzon, Stanley, and Niku are all exposed to Seattle, so I don't think those work. Sandin is a good call though. That could be something that does work.
23 mar à 14 h 56
#18
Leafs and Jets
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Quoting: Anus_McLeod
We'll see what he ultimately goes for (if he goes), but it sounds like teams aren't valuing late 2021 firsts very highly (they probably are 2022 firsts though), so I'm not counting on a lot of first rounders being moved.

Lauzon, Stanley, and Niku are all exposed to Seattle, so I don't think those work. Sandin is a good call though. That could be something that does work.


I mean, I only picked Linus Sandin because he's Rasmus's brother. Maybe he's actually pretty good himself.
23 mar à 15 h 04
#19
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Quoting: Saskleaf
I mean, I only picked Linus Sandin because he's Rasmus's brother. Maybe he's actually pretty good himself.


Well that shows how closely I looked. I thought it was Rasmus. Still, you can see my logic of expansion draft exempt assets. You may not agree with it, but I personally think it's going to be important for Nashville.
23 mar à 15 h 19
#20
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Quoting: Saskleaf
Ya, I know. But when losing a guy like Ryan Graves is a best case scenario (which I agree it would be), you're in trouble.


Not really, it means you aren't worried because you have Makar, Girard, Toews and Byram plus EJ, Timmins and MacDonald, plus Barron, Helleson and others to come. Of course I'm sure most Avs fans would love to be able to keep Graves and I'd love them to pick Compher or Donskoi instead but I don't think they will. It's just a case of 'it is what it is' with an expansion draft. We lose a decent player whichever way.
Anus_McLeod, Saskleaf et Richard88 a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 16 h 09
#21
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Quoting: Anus_McLeod
Well that shows how closely I looked. I thought it was Rasmus. Still, you can see my logic of expansion draft exempt assets. You may not agree with it, but I personally think it's going to be important for Nashville.


I agree Nashville won't want expansion draft eligble players. Rasmus Sandin for Ekholm isn't bad, but if Nashville wants more than Rasmus, it should be a no. Liljgren plus could also work.

While the idea of Ekholm to Colorado is good in theory, it doesn't make much sense because he or Devon Toews, or a valuable forward (Landy, Bura, Kadri) would go to the Kraken, and that's provided Johnson waives (if not the avs have a major mess on their hands).
23 mar à 16 h 11
#22
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Quoting: TJTwolf
Not really, it means you aren't worried because you have Makar, Girard, Toews and Byram plus EJ, Timmins and MacDonald, plus Barron, Helleson and others to come. Of course I'm sure most Avs fans would love to be able to keep Graves and I'd love them to pick Compher or Donskoi instead but I don't think they will. It's just a case of 'it is what it is' with an expansion draft. We lose a decent player whichever way.


I agree Colorado is still in a good position overall, but in regards to the expansion draft they are the team most at risk from losing a big name player, like the likes of Karlsson, Smith, Marchesault, Theodore and Fleury are to the Golden Knights.
23 mar à 18 h 05
#23
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Quoting: Saskleaf
I agree Colorado is still in a good position overall, but in regards to the expansion draft they are the team most at risk from losing a big name player, like the likes of Karlsson, Smith, Marchesault, Theodore and Fleury are to the Golden Knights.


For sure but like I said 'it is what it is'. A team has to consider themselves fortunate they have that excess of riches if they're looking at it with optimistic eyes or can look at it pessimistically and say why did the expansion have to happen now? Either way it changes nothing, you're losing a good player.
Saskleaf a aimé ceci.
23 mar à 18 h 23
#24
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Quoting: TJTwolf
For sure but like I said 'it is what it is'. A team has to consider themselves fortunate they have that excess of riches if they're looking at it with optimistic eyes or can look at it pessimistically and say why did the expansion have to happen now? Either way it changes nothing, you're losing a good player.


Yes, exactly.
23 mar à 18 h 27
#25
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Quoting: TJTwolf
For sure but like I said 'it is what it is'. A team has to consider themselves fortunate they have that excess of riches if they're looking at it with optimistic eyes or can look at it pessimistically and say why did the expansion have to happen now? Either way it changes nothing, you're losing a good player.


On the expansion draft, I really don't think that's a reason not to do this. In either case, the result is essentially the same:

Johnson waives: Seattle picks between Graves, Donskoi, Jost (and now Ekholm). Let's say they pick one of Graves and Ekholm. Well, you still have one of them and can either keep them or trade them to recover some assets.

Johnson doesn't waive: Seattle picks between the above, as well as Jost and Burakovsky. You still get to keep a player you wouldn't have otherwise.

So the whole don't do it because of the xdraft doesn't add up.
 
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