The only trades that actually make sense

Forums/Armchair-GM

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Créé par: ZiggyPalffy

Équipe: 2020-21 Blue Jackets de Columbus

Date de création initiale: 8 janv. 2021

Publié: 8 janv. 2021

Mode - plafond salarial: Basique

Description

CBJ is perhaps the most fit for contention as they've ever been. Maybe some D upgrades at the deadline, but not much else.

They are not a rebuilding team so any trades such as picks and prospects that we keep seeing are not realistic. The only way they trade Dubois is if they get a center of the same stature or an upgrade at the same position. Otherwise they are walking themselves out of contention and have to explain that to their fan base who's suffered enough over the years.

The only teams that make sense are LA and Montreal.

LA is a bit unrealistic simply due to Blake saying they aren't trading Kopitar, Doughty, Brown, or Quick. I think they would at least consider it if Dubois and Bemstrom were offered. Kopitar is a massive upgrade over Dubois, yes he's older, but has shown no signs of slowing down nor has he had a huge lack of production despite being on a bad rebuilding team. He also has the Cup experience CBJ doesn't have. He fits their CBJ mold as well.

Montreal, Dubois and Suzuki would solidify their top 6 center group which would make Danault and KK expendable. I think Danault extended and KK would make a fair return for Dubois and Grigorenko(3C replacement for KK) Not a lot of Montreal fans like this proposal because of what they are giving up, but it is a fair return and they get Dubois out of it. You have to remember, KK is struggling player that still hasn't proved much yet. That is why Danualt must be extended.

I personally think the Montreal trade makes most sense.

Transactions

CBJ

Détails additionnels:

Danault Extended: 5.75M x 5 years.

MTL

Dubois
Grigorenko

CBJ

Kopitar, Anze (2 000 000 $ retained)

LAK

Dubois
Bemstrom

Rachats de contrats

Scott Hartnell: 1 250 000 $
Alexander Wennberg: 441 667 $

Repêchage	1e ronde	2e ronde	3e ronde	4e ronde	5e ronde	6e ronde	7e ronde
2021
2022
2023

FORMATION

VUE À LONG TERME

INTÉGRÉ

TEXTE INTÉGRÉ

TAILLE DE LA FORMATION	PLAFOND SALARIAL	CAP HIT	EXCÉDENTS	BONIS	ESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
23	81 500 000 $	56 143 333 $	0 $	3 600 000 $	25 356 667 $

Ailier gauche	Centre	Ailier droit
Texier, Alexandre 897 500 $897 500 $ AG, C, AD RFA - 1	Danault, Phillip 3 083 333 $3 083 333 $ C UFA - 1	Bjorkstrand, Oliver 2 500 000 $2 500 000 $ AD, AG UFA - 1
Foligno, Nick 1 375 000 $1 375 000 $ AG, C, AD M-NTC, NMC UFA - 1	Domi, Max 1 325 000 $1 325 000 $ C, AD UFA - 2	Atkinson, Cam 5 875 000 $5 875 000 $ AD, AG M-NTC UFA - 5
Nyquist, Gustav 2 750 000 $2 750 000 $ AG, AD UFA - 3	Kotkaniemi, Jesperi 925 000 $925 000 $ (2 500 000 $$2M) C UFA - 1	Bemström, Emil 925 000 $925 000 $ (850 000 $$850K) AD, AG RFA - 2
Jenner, Boone 3 750 000 $3 750 000 $ C, AG UFA - 2		Nash, Riley 2 750 000 $2 750 000 $ C, AD UFA - 1
	Koivu, Mikko 1 500 000 $1 500 000 $ (250 000 $$250K) C NMC UFA - 1

Défenseur gaucher	Défenseur droitier	Gardien de but
Werenski, Zachary 5 000 000 $5 000 000 $ DG UFA - 2	Jones, Seth 5 400 000 $5 400 000 $ DD M-NTC UFA - 2	Korpisalo, Joonas 2 800 000 $2 800 000 $ G UFA - 2
Gavrikov, Vladislav 2 800 000 $2 800 000 $ DG UFA - 3	Savard, David 1 062 500 $1 062 500 $ DD UFA - 1	Merzlikins, Elvis 4 000 000 $4 000 000 $ G UFA - 2
Harrington, Scott 1 633 333 $1 633 333 $ DG UFA - 2	Kukan, Dean 1 650 000 $1 650 000 $ DG/DD UFA - 2

Laissés de côté	Liste des blessés (IR)	Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
Gerbe, Nathan 750 000 $750 000 $ AG, AD UFA - 2		Kopitar, Anze 8 000 000 $8 000 000 $ C M-NTC UFA - 4
Robinson, Eric 975 000 $975 000 $ AG UFA - 2		Dubois, Pierre-Luc 5 000 000 $5 000 000 $ C UFA - 2
Carlsson, Gabriel 725 000 $725 000 $ DG UFA - 2		Grigorenko, Mikhail 1 200 000 $1 200 000 $ C, AG UFA - 1
		Dubinsky, Brandon 5 850 000 $5 850 000 $ C, AG M-NTC, NMC UFA - 1

8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 13

Kotkaniemi15

Former Hockey Fan

Rejoint: juin 2017

Messages: 13,144

Mentions "j'aime": 10,516

Stop trying to take our players just so you can offload PLD. There is clearly a terrible fit trade-wise between the Jackets and Habs, and we aren’t making a trade just because someone is French-Canadian. KK is untouchable, so stop making ridiculous offers.

HabsRealGM a aimé ceci.

8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 19

Shanesaw9

Habs 2010

Rejoint: mai 2020

Messages: 1,517

Mentions "j'aime": 949

The habs trade is a no, the Kopitar one very interesting though. Those types of trades make the most sense for a Dubois deal I think.

Of course, nothing would be better than if CBJ could just lock Dubois up long term. CBJ needs to get that part figured out.

ZiggyPalffy et HabsRealGM a aimé ceci.

8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 25

dzad96

Rejoint: févr. 2019

Messages: 2,495

Mentions "j'aime": 1,047

Quoting: Kotkaniemi15

I've probably seen 10 trades on here for PLD with KK. Easy bud. most made by hab fans

Kotkaniemi15 a aimé ceci.

8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 26

Kotkaniemi15

Former Hockey Fan

Rejoint: juin 2017

Messages: 13,144

Mentions "j'aime": 10,516

Quoting: dzad96

I've probably seen 10 trades on here for PLD with KK. Easy bud. most made by hab fans

I know. And I’m sick of it, but at least it’s usually easier to reason with fans of other teams than it is to reason with the many insane habs fans of the website.

dzad96 et Shanesaw9 a aimé ceci.

8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 33

Saskleaf

Go leafs go

Rejoint: avr. 2020

Messages: 13,232

Mentions "j'aime": 9,186

Quoting: Kotkaniemi15

Dude everyone know PLD is better than KK. Makes a lot of sense for the habs.

ZiggyPalffy a aimé ceci.

8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 51

Subbanator7667

Subbanator

Rejoint: juill. 2017

Messages: 7,318

Mentions "j'aime": 3,331

I think that this is what it would take for the Habs to get him.

This site is funny in a way though, Habs always need more value in a trade to get a star player then other teams posts for people on this site to think its a good deal. I have seen far less for PLD on this site that people think are good trades and here we are with a good offer and people think its not enough.

ZiggyPalffy et Shanesaw9 a aimé ceci.

8 janv. 2021 à 15 h 18

ZiggyPalffy

Démarrer sujet

Banni

Rejoint: mai 2018

Messages: 9,721

Mentions "j'aime": 2,805

Quoting: Kotkaniemi15

I know. And I’m sick of it, but at least it’s usually easier to reason with fans of other teams than it is to reason with the many insane habs fans of the website.

You're the only Habs fan that comes off insane. No other Habs fan values KK like you. In a trade for Dubois, KK is involved in reality not fantasy. Get used to it

8 janv. 2021 à 15 h 25

Shanesaw9

Habs 2010

Rejoint: mai 2020

Messages: 1,517

Mentions "j'aime": 949

Modifié 8 janv. 2021 à 15 h 32

Quoting: ZiggyPalffy

You're the only Habs fan that comes off insane. No other Habs fan values KK like you. In a trade for Dubois, KK is involved in reality not fantasy. Get used to it

He didn't say KK would not be involved (from a CBJ perspective), he said Dubois to the Habs is not realistic, which I agree with.

I personally would not trade our Selke candidate center who also outplayed and outproduced Dubois at 5 on 5 last season while also adding Kotkaniemi who all habs fans expect to be a #1 or #2C in the near future. Yes KK is not Dubois, but he is also two years younger and was drafted with the expectation that long term he would become a #1C.

Kotkaniemi15 et HabsRealGM a aimé ceci.

8 janv. 2021 à 15 h 49

Campabee

Rejoint: nov. 2018

Messages: 15,480

Mentions "j'aime": 6,418

I have made a few Dubois trades myself and included KK in a couple. OK is not the player I would give up for Dubois if I had my choice. And I definitely am not giving up both KK and Danault. Montreal is not trading 2 Centers for 1 especially not one they view to be a Barkov type player in the future and Danault who is one of the best 2 way centers in the league. I only ever in Clyde one of alDanault or KK in any proposal and prefer the Danault proposals as Danault fits with Columbus' win now mentality. A package of Danault + Tatar + Norlinder with both Tuna and Danault extended has more than enough value for Dubois. However even if we don't trade for Dubois I would be just as happy with the team we have now. So yes having Dubois would be great but IMO it doesn't improve the team enough to go out of our way and overpay significantly for him.

ZiggyPalffy, Shanesaw9 et HabsRealGM a aimé ceci.

9 janv. 2021 à 14 h 7

#10

HabsRealGM

Rejoint: sept. 2019

Messages: 146

Mentions "j'aime": 27

Quoting: Saskleaf

Dude everyone know PLD is better than KK. Makes a lot of sense for the habs.

Disagree. Maybe at the moment. Not in a year or two. Habs keep KK. He's gonna be a beast.

9 janv. 2021 à 14 h 17

#11

HabsRealGM

Rejoint: sept. 2019

Messages: 146

Mentions "j'aime": 27

Quoting: ZiggyPalffy

You're the only Habs fan that comes off insane. No other Habs fan values KK like you. In a trade for Dubois, KK is involved in reality not fantasy. Get used to it

Disagree. We don't need to trade KK for Dubois. Why make a move for the sake of making a move. Kk + Danault is better than Dubois everyday of the year. Losing both makes our team worse. Kk will be just as good as Dubois.

If you're trading with MB. Danault + a high level prospect (Poehling, Caufield) or a first round pick. Might get it done. Even then I'm not sure you even make the trade. If we can re-sign Danault long term and keep KK and Suzuki we've got a Trio down the middle that not many teams can match.

We only trade for Dubois if IT IMPROVES our team. The above trade and comments here don't improve us. Everyone is salivating over Dubois. We have a solid group of three I'll take all day. Why trade for someone that may or not make us better as a group.

Campabee a aimé ceci.

9 janv. 2021 à 17 h 27

#12

Saskleaf

Go leafs go

Rejoint: avr. 2020

Messages: 13,232

Mentions "j'aime": 9,186

Quoting: HabsRealGM

Disagree. Maybe at the moment. Not in a year or two. Habs keep KK. He's gonna be a beast.

It's hard to tell. I think KK will be about as good as PLD in like 3 years. But he's still too young to know just how good he'll be. At the moment, I'd say PLD is worth more than him.

9 janv. 2021 à 17 h 44

#13

HabsForEver

Rejoint: janv. 2019

Messages: 6,103

Mentions "j'aime": 2,240

Quoting: Saskleaf

It's hard to tell. I think KK will be about as good as PLD in like 3 years. But he's still too young to know just how good he'll be. At the moment, I'd say PLD is worth more than him.

If it's straight up I'm taking PLD all day every day. Maybe KK is better than him at one point, but I'm going with the surefire guy.

Saskleaf a aimé ceci.

9 janv. 2021 à 18 h 27

#14

Saskleaf

Go leafs go

Rejoint: avr. 2020

Messages: 13,232

Mentions "j'aime": 9,186

Quoting: HabsForEver

If it's straight up I'm taking PLD all day every day. Maybe KK is better than him at one point, but I'm going with the surefire guy.

I agree.

9 janv. 2021 à 18 h 59

#15

HabsRealGM

Rejoint: sept. 2019

Messages: 146

Mentions "j'aime": 27

Quoting: Saskleaf

It's hard to tell. I think KK will be about as good as PLD in like 3 years. But he's still too young to know just how good he'll be. At the moment, I'd say PLD is worth more than him.

Agree. At the moment. But you have to consider long term when you' re making trades of this caliber. A trade like this is a 5-10 year bet. Talk to me at the end of the year and see if KK is as good a PLD. I'm willing to bet they will be closer than you think. I'd also be willing to wait and find out. #notrade

Saskleaf a aimé ceci.

9 janv. 2021 à 19 h 3

#16

HabsRealGM

Rejoint: sept. 2019

Messages: 146

Mentions "j'aime": 27

Quoting: HabsForEver

If it's straight up I'm taking PLD all day every day. Maybe KK is better than him at one point, but I'm going with the surefire guy.

Of course you are. Because you are looking at right now. No GM makes trades like this without considering the long term. No question at this moment in time PLD is better. No debate. The question is who is the more complete player in 3-5 years? It's like when MB trade Subban for Weber. At the time Subban looked like the better player. Who would you rather have today? Who is better for your team?

9 janv. 2021 à 19 h 20

#17

Saskleaf

Go leafs go

Rejoint: avr. 2020

Messages: 13,232

Mentions "j'aime": 9,186

Quoting: HabsRealGM

Oh course. But I'm just not sure if in 3-5 years that KK will be better than PLD.

9 janv. 2021 à 19 h 24

#18

HabsForEver

Rejoint: janv. 2019

Messages: 6,103

Mentions "j'aime": 2,240

Quoting: HabsRealGM

I'm thinking 100% long term. It's not like Dubois is 28 or 29 and already out of his Prime, we are comparing two players here who are 2 years apart and we both know Montreal's development problems. In the perfect world, Kotkaniemi maxes out at PLD's level, and that's best case. Like I said, I'd rather go with Dubois because he guarantees we are getting a good 1C.

Who is the more complete player? I'm going with PLD because there's no surefire shot that KK becomes anything better than a 3C. This doesn't compare to the PK vs Weber trade whatsoever, I said MB won the trade when he made the deal and I say he won it now. Subban wasn't the better player then and he sure as hell isn't now.

9 janv. 2021 à 20 h 31

#19

HabsRealGM

Rejoint: sept. 2019

Messages: 146

Mentions "j'aime": 27

Quoting: HabsForEver

Agree to disagree I guess. I think KK is definitely better than a 3C. I think we've only seen a small sample size and from what I've seen he has all skills to be a 1C or 2C, he just hasn't put it together yet. Up till now he's been a kid. He got drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Everyone develops slightly different. 2 years is a big difference when you're talking about 22 vs. 19.I haven't seen enough PLD to know all his intangibles but I'm pretty high on KK as a pretty complete player. Don't see the need at this point to make a trade if CBJ want KK +... Too much to lose when you could hold onto the chips you have. Agree, Weber much better then and now. It is similar situation though.

9 janv. 2021 à 20 h 47

#20

HabsForEver

Rejoint: janv. 2019

Messages: 6,103

Mentions "j'aime": 2,240

Quoting: HabsRealGM

For KK being better than a 3C, I'm talking about right now. There are no guarantees he develops into anything more. There's a real good shot he does, but nothing is guaranteed. I'm not saying KK is a bust or anything (Way too early to even consider that), I'm just talking about who will be the better player. Dubouis is 22 so everything you are saying about KK is the same for PLD. Neither players are even in their primes yet.

HabsRealGM a aimé ceci.

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