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One trade to upgrade the Top 6

Créé par: The_Rocket
Équipe: 2020-21 Canucks de Vancouver
Date de création initiale: 1 janv. 2021
Publié: 1 janv. 2021
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
Cap hit ends up being almost equal. Carter is basically a stop gap for Podkolzin. LA gets the younger player with likely more offensive upside and a pick for taking back Beagle.

Carter is definitely more reliable than Virtanen is for this coming season and can play centre if there are injuries
Transactions
LAK
  1. Beagle, Jay
  2. Virtanen, Jake
  3. Choix de 3e ronde en 2021 (VAN)
Rachats de contrats
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TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2381 500 000 $76 651 575 $1 700 000 $4 550 000 $4 848 425 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
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5 250 000 $5 250 000 $
C, AG, AD
UFA - 3
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925 000 $925 000 $ (Bonis de performance2 850 000 $$3M)
C, AG
UFA - 1
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5 875 000 $5 875 000 $
AD
UFA - 2
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3 750 000 $3 750 000 $
AG
UFA - 1
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4 125 000 $4 125 000 $
C
UFA - 3
Logo de Kings de Los Angeles
2 636 364 $2 636 364 $
AD, C
UFA - 2
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3 000 000 $3 000 000 $
AG
M-NTC
UFA - 2
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950 000 $950 000 $
C, AD
UFA - 1
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800 000 $800 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 1
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1 225 000 $1 225 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 2
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4 375 000 $4 375 000 $
AD, C
M-NTC
UFA - 1
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825 000 $825 000 $
AD, C
UFA - 2
Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
3 366 666 $3 366 666 $
AG
UFA - 1
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6 000 000 $6 000 000 $
AG, AD
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
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916 667 $916 667 $ (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
DG
UFA - 1
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6 000 000 $6 000 000 $
DD
NTC
UFA - 4
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1 050 000 $1 050 000 $
G
UFA - 1
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6 000 000 $6 000 000 $
DG
NMC
UFA - 1
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5 950 000 $5 950 000 $
DG/DD
M-NTC
UFA - 5
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4 300 000 $4 300 000 $
G
M-NTC
UFA - 2
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863 333 $863 333 $ (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
DG
UFA - 1
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700 000 $700 000 $
DD
UFA - 1
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2 000 000 $2 000 000 $
DG/DD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
3 500 000 $3 500 000 $
AG, AD
NMC
UFA - 3
Équipe de réserve
Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
925 000 $925 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0) (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
DG
RFA - 2
Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
811 667 $811 667 $ (0 $$00 $$0) (Bonis de performance82 500 $$82K)
G
RFA - 2
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700 000 $700 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0)
C
UFA - 1
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750 000 $750 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0)
AD
UFA - 1
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700 000 $700 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0)
AG, C
UFA - 1
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700 000 $700 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0)
DD
UFA - 1

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1 janv. 2021 à 20 h 15
#1
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I like it.
I’m fine with trading Virtanen, and this definitely upgrades the top 6. Carters on the book for two years but so is Beagle so that’s not a huge issue.
If management thinks Podkolzin is ready for a top 6 role in two years this makes good sense to me.
1 janv. 2021 à 20 h 16
#2
2018 Canucks
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Cap hit isn’t the same other than the amount.
2 players for 1 player it’s simple.
A 36yr old with 2yrs left is definitely not the answer.
This trade wouldn’t age well.
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1 janv. 2021 à 20 h 20
#3
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I would be much more interested if Carter had one year left. As it stands I don't think trading a younger, cost controlled asset for an older, more expensive asset makes sense.
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1 janv. 2021 à 20 h 26
#4
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na I'd rather have Virtanen
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1 janv. 2021 à 20 h 35
#5
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Quoting: TheAlien
na I'd rather have Virtanen


Why’s everyone so attached to Virtanen?

He’s a one dimensional, lazy, sub 20 goal player who is disliked by his teammates and not trusted by his coach.
Benning was apparently trying to trade him this offseason and was unable to, don’t know what the ask was but I think it’s clear he’s not thought overly high upon by the organization.
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1 janv. 2021 à 20 h 52
#6
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Quoting: Reason
Why’s everyone so attached to Virtanen?

He’s a one dimensional, lazy, sub 20 goal player who is disliked by his teammates and not trusted by his coach.
Benning was apparently trying to trade him this offseason and was unable to, don’t know what the ask was but I think it’s clear he’s not thought overly high upon by the organization.


I'm 100% with you. I dont love Carter but he's better than Virtanen. Big Tuna doesn't belong on a team of Orcas.
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1 janv. 2021 à 20 h 53
#7
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Quoting: Reason
Why’s everyone so attached to Virtanen?

He’s a one dimensional, lazy, sub 20 goal player who is disliked by his teammates and not trusted by his coach.
Benning was apparently trying to trade him this offseason and was unable to, don’t know what the ask was but I think it’s clear he’s not thought overly high upon by the organization.


As much as everyone likes to sh*t on Virtanen he has improved every year so until he plateaus I wouldn't wanna move him for nothing plus he's better than a washed 36-year-old
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1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 0
#8
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Quoting: TheAlien
As much as everyone likes to sh*t on Virtanen he has improved every year so until he plateaus I wouldn't wanna move him for nothing plus he's better than a washed 36-year-old


By everyone, are you referring to fans or his coach, GM, teammates and organization?
1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 11
#9
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Quoting: Reason
By everyone, are you referring to fans or his coach, GM, teammates and organization?


na by everyone, I mean people like you
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1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 19
#10
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Quoting: TheAlien
As much as everyone likes to sh*t on Virtanen he has improved every year so until he plateaus I wouldn't wanna move him for nothing plus he's better than a washed 36-year-old


He's tolerable as a third liner, and that somewhere he belongs, with Gaudette and Roussel/Baetschi/Hoglander. Having him in the top 6 is kinda sad and shows the lack of depth. This is why I wanted either Leivo or Toffoli back.
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1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 20
#11
Best In The World
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Easy no for VAN. They would much rather keep a younger Virtanen.
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1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 23
#12
Best In The World
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Quoting: Reason
Why’s everyone so attached to Virtanen?

He’s a one dimensional, lazy, sub 20 goal player who is disliked by his teammates and not trusted by his coach.
Benning was apparently trying to trade him this offseason and was unable to, don’t know what the ask was but I think it’s clear he’s not thought overly high upon by the organization.


So your suggestion is to trade a young cost controlled top 6 forward for a 36 year old who is pretty much close to retirement? Benning tested the market for Virtanen but he is not going to sell him for some old washed up player.
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1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 25
#13
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Quoting: CEO
He's tolerable as a third liner, and that somewhere he belongs, with Gaudette and Roussel/Baetschi/Hoglander. Having him in the top 6 is kinda sad and shows the lack of depth. This is why I wanted either Leivo or Toffoli back.


Leivo who is coming off major knee surgery and Toffoli who is similar to Boeser, both with terrible foot speed in the top 6? VAN needed to improve their defense, scoring goals is not an issue for them.
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1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 28
#14
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Quoting: TheAlien
na by everyone, I mean people like you


Based on your intelligent response, and your even more intelligent use of grammar, you’ve made me a believer of your perspective. I’ll stop listening to the insiders and the organization, from now on I’ll only get my intel from “TheAlien”!
1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 30
#15
Banni
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Make it a 2nd and Kings might accept.
1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 31
#16
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Quoting: brocklesnar
Leivo who is coming off major knee surgery and Toffoli who is similar to Boeser, both with terrible foot speed in the top 6? VAN needed to improve their defense, scoring goals is not an issue for them.


U make a good argument, but I'm still inclined to say that Virtanen for a rental is worth it
1 janv. 2021 à 21 h 37
#17
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Quoting: CEO
U make a good argument, but I'm still inclined to say that Virtanen for a rental is worth it


I don't think Benning is going the rental route this year maybe when all these bad contracts come off the books.
1 janv. 2021 à 22 h 48
#18
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Quoting: brocklesnar
So your suggestion is to trade a young cost controlled top 6 forward for a 36 year old who is pretty much close to retirement? Benning tested the market for Virtanen but he is not going to sell him for some old washed up player.



No, those are your words not mine.
What I said was that I am ok with trading a player I consider to be a lazy 3rd liner that is not liked by his teammates nor trusted by his coach. Third line players are expendable. Third line players that are lazy, disliked and not trusted, are not overly valuable assets, even if they are youngish.

I agree with you that Carter is close to retirement, I disagree with you that he is washed up. He’s only got two years left on his contract and I think he’s still got some life left in the tank. He had 17 goals in the shortened season last year, and if he plays with either Peterson or Horvat I’m betting he would be close to the 20 goal mark again, prorated for the shortened season of course.

I’m ok with Carter for the following reasons:

Carter can adequately hold down the second line RW spot for the next two season, hopefully Podkolzin is ready to fill it after that.

Vancouver is set to take a step back this year, Carter is a better second line RW option than what VAN currently has.

Carter is a multiple Stanley Cup winner, which is an added benefit to a dressing room with a lot of young players.

One additional thing I like about the trade:
Beagle is an overpaid fourth line center signed for another 2 years. Sutter can fill that spot this year, and a more cost effective option can fill it the year after.
1 janv. 2021 à 23 h 5
#19
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Quoting: Reason
No, those are your words not mine.
What I said was that I am ok with trading a player I consider to be a lazy 3rd liner that is not liked by his teammates nor trusted by his coach. Third line players are expendable. Third line players that are lazy, disliked and not trusted, are not overly valuable assets, even if they are youngish.

I agree with you that Carter is close to retirement, I disagree with you that he is washed up. He’s only got two years left on his contract and I think he’s still got some life left in the tank. He had 17 goals in the shortened season last year, and if he plays with either Peterson or Horvat I’m betting he would be close to the 20 goal mark again, prorated for the shortened season of course.

I’m ok with Carter for the following reasons:

Carter can adequately hold down the second line RW spot for the next two season, hopefully Podkolzin is ready to fill it after that.

Vancouver is set to take a step back this year, Carter is a better second line RW option than what VAN currently has.

Carter is a multiple Stanley Cup winner, which is an added benefit to a dressing room with a lot of young players.

One additional thing I like about the trade:
Beagle is an overpaid fourth line center signed for another 2 years. Sutter can fill that spot this year, and a more cost effective option can fill it the year after.


I would love to read the reports where is teammates dislike him can you provide me that? because what I remember before the playoffs started he threw a questionable hit in a scrimmage during the mini training camp, but I have never heard or read that his teammates dislike him prior to that. As a Canucks fan this is something new to me. Travis Green has always shown Virtanen tough love and knows how to get the most out of him. The same Sutter that can't stay healthy with terrible hips? Carter an aging asset and your okay trading a a young 20+ goal scorer who is still improving each year?
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1 janv. 2021 à 23 h 59
#20
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Quoting: Reason
No, those are your words not mine.
What I said was that I am ok with trading a player I consider to be a lazy 3rd liner that is not liked by his teammates nor trusted by his coach. Third line players are expendable. Third line players that are lazy, disliked and not trusted, are not overly valuable assets, even if they are youngish.

I agree with you that Carter is close to retirement, I disagree with you that he is washed up. He’s only got two years left on his contract and I think he’s still got some life left in the tank. He had 17 goals in the shortened season last year, and if he plays with either Peterson or Horvat I’m betting he would be close to the 20 goal mark again, prorated for the shortened season of course.

I’m ok with Carter for the following reasons:

Carter can adequately hold down the second line RW spot for the next two season, hopefully Podkolzin is ready to fill it after that.

Vancouver is set to take a step back this year, Carter is a better second line RW option than what VAN currently has.

Carter is a multiple Stanley Cup winner, which is an added benefit to a dressing room with a lot of young players.

One additional thing I like about the trade:
Beagle is an overpaid fourth line center signed for another 2 years. Sutter can fill that spot this year, and a more cost effective option can fill it the year after.


When have any of his teammates said they didn't like him or the coach say he didn't trust him? Do you have some inside info that no one else has?
Virtanen has improved every season and I think with top 6 minutes he'll do well. There's no way he gets traded for a declining asset like Carter.
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2 janv. 2021 à 3 h 3
#21
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Quoting: brocklesnar
I would love to read the reports where is teammates dislike him can you provide me that? because what I remember before the playoffs started he threw a questionable hit in a scrimmage during the mini training camp, but I have never heard or read that his teammates dislike him prior to that. As a Canucks fan this is something new to me. Travis Green has always shown Virtanen tough love and knows how to get the most out of him. The same Sutter that can't stay healthy with terrible hips? Carter an aging asset and your okay trading a a young 20+ goal scorer who is still improving each year?


I would love to read the reports where is teammates dislike him can you provide me that?

Ill give you this one. After looking for a quote, I will admit I may have misspoken on that point. I remember this being discussed on Vancouver sports radio after: Horvat had answered "Who is the player you would least like to quarantine with?", when pictures of Virtanen at a nightclub surfaced on social media during Phase 2 of the NHL's return to play, and after the altercation in the scrimmage. I cannot however find any type of quote so it may have been more speculation based radio talk than actual reports from inside the locker room, that I cannot recall.

Travis Green has always shown Virtanen tough love and knows how to get the most out of him

The only statement I've made about Green is that he doesn't trust Virtanen. If you Google, "Why doesn't Travis Green trust Jake Virtanen?" articles will pop up from reputable insiders. Green's trust in Virtanen has been brought up many times by many people.

The same Sutter that can't stay healthy with terrible hips?

I am fine with Sutter as a 4C for a season. He and Beagle are comparable, and if it rids us of two years of Beagle I am fine with it. Sutter played in 2/3 of the games last season, but if he's is injured at some point during the season there are others that can fill in for stretches, the Canucks have an abundance of bottom 6 forwards. As a side note I don't have a problem with Beagle as a 4C, but not at 3 mil.

your okay trading a a young 20+ goal scorer who is still improving each year?

I have already answered this, however Virtanen has not yet proven to be a 20+ goal scorer.
In Virtanen's 5 seasons with the Canucks he has never scored 20+ goals, he could have this year but there's no guarantees with his inconsistent play. If you add his regular season and playoff games/points together for 2019-2020 he had 20 goals in 85 games. I'm not saying he wont ever reach the 20 goal mark but he has yet to do so. He's also 25 this year, most players hit their peak at 24-25.
2 janv. 2021 à 11 h 50
#22
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Quoting: Reason
I would love to read the reports where is teammates dislike him can you provide me that?

Ill give you this one. After looking for a quote, I will admit I may have misspoken on that point. I remember this being discussed on Vancouver sports radio after: Horvat had answered "Who is the player you would least like to quarantine with?", when pictures of Virtanen at a nightclub surfaced on social media during Phase 2 of the NHL's return to play, and after the altercation in the scrimmage. I cannot however find any type of quote so it may have been more speculation based radio talk than actual reports from inside the locker room, that I cannot recall.

Travis Green has always shown Virtanen tough love and knows how to get the most out of him

The only statement I've made about Green is that he doesn't trust Virtanen. If you Google, "Why doesn't Travis Green trust Jake Virtanen?" articles will pop up from reputable insiders. Green's trust in Virtanen has been brought up many times by many people.

The same Sutter that can't stay healthy with terrible hips?

I am fine with Sutter as a 4C for a season. He and Beagle are comparable, and if it rids us of two years of Beagle I am fine with it. Sutter played in 2/3 of the games last season, but if he's is injured at some point during the season there are others that can fill in for stretches, the Canucks have an abundance of bottom 6 forwards. As a side note I don't have a problem with Beagle as a 4C, but not at 3 mil.

your okay trading a a young 20+ goal scorer who is still improving each year?

I have already answered this, however Virtanen has not yet proven to be a 20+ goal scorer.
In Virtanen's 5 seasons with the Canucks he has never scored 20+ goals, he could have this year but there's no guarantees with his inconsistent play. If you add his regular season and playoff games/points together for 2019-2020 he had 20 goals in 85 games. I'm not saying he wont ever reach the 20 goal mark but he has yet to do so. He's also 25 this year, most players hit their peak at 24-25.


Great so basically you've been talking out of your ass and have no idea what you're talking about
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2 janv. 2021 à 22 h 16
#23
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Quoting: TheAlien
Great so basically you've been talking out of your ass and have no idea what you're talking about


You are quite the aggressive internet talker… that’s now multiple statements from you…

Talking out my bum?

I admitted that I may have misspoken as I am unwilling to take the time to back up that very small part of my overall argument. You may have the time and desire to go through archived sports radio to try and prove a point over an internet debate, I personally do not. Everything else is easily verifiable, but no I'm not going to do that for you either.

I come on here to have an engaging and at least somewhat mature discussions, neither of which are happening here so I'll moving onto the next thread.
3 janv. 2021 à 6 h 1
#24
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Quoting: Reason
I like it.
I’m fine with trading Virtanen, and this definitely upgrades the top 6. Carters on the book for two years but so is Beagle so that’s not a huge issue.
If management thinks Podkolzin is ready for a top 6 role in two years this makes good sense to me.


who in their right mind trades a 24 yo for carter?
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3 janv. 2021 à 6 h 1
#25
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Quoting: Reason
Why’s everyone so attached to Virtanen?

He’s a one dimensional, lazy, sub 20 goal player who is disliked by his teammates and not trusted by his coach.
Benning was apparently trying to trade him this offseason and was unable to, don’t know what the ask was but I think it’s clear he’s not thought overly high upon by the organization.


he is only 24, twenty four
brocklesnar a aimé ceci.
 
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