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Kane

Créé par: Eli
Équipe: 2020-21 Capitals de Washington
Date de création initiale: 23 oct. 2020
Publié: 23 oct. 2020
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
Hawks fans on here say they won't trade Kane unless they get a lot of picks and prospects back. Okay.
Transactions
WSH
  1. Kane, Patrick (5 000 000 $ retained)
  2. Murphy, Connor
CHI
  1. Geisser, Tobias
  2. Gersich, Shane
  3. Jensen, Nick
  4. Johansen, Lucas
  5. Leason, Brett
  6. Malenstyn, Beck
  7. Oshie, T.J.
  8. Pánik, Richard
  9. Choix de 1e ronde en 2021 (WSH)
  10. Choix de 2e ronde en 2021 (WSH)
  11. Choix de 2e ronde en 2022 (WSH)
  12. Choix de 3e ronde en 2023 (WSH)
Enfoui
Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
2021
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
Logo de VGK
Logo de WSH
2022
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
2023
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
Logo de WSH
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2181 500 000 $63 379 045 $419 749 $600 000 $18 120 955 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
Logo de Capitals de Washington
9 538 462 $9 538 462 $
AG
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo de Capitals de Washington
9 200 000 $9 200 000 $
C
NMC
UFA - 5
Logo de Capitals de Washington
5 166 667 $5 166 667 $
AD
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo de Capitals de Washington
3 350 000 $3 350 000 $
AG
UFA - 1
Logo de Capitals de Washington
3 900 000 $3 900 000 $
C
M-NTC
UFA - 5
Logo de Blackhawks de Chicago
-2 375 000 $-2 375 000 $
AD
NMC
UFA - 3
Logo de Capitals de Washington
894 167 $894 167 $
AG, C
RFA - 4
Logo de Capitals de Washington
2 415 000 $2 415 000 $
C
UFA - 3
Logo de Capitals de Washington
1 500 000 $1 500 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 3
Logo de Capitals de Washington
2 750 000 $2 750 000 $
AG
UFA - 3
Logo de Capitals de Washington
750 000 $750 000 $
C
UFA - 2
Logo de Capitals de Washington
795 000 $795 000 $
AD, AG, C
UFA - 4
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
Logo de Capitals de Washington
3 900 000 $3 900 000 $
DG
UFA - 4
Logo de Capitals de Washington
8 000 000 $8 000 000 $
DD
M-NTC
UFA - 6
Logo de Capitals de Washington
1 500 000 $1 500 000 $
G
UFA - 1
Logo de Capitals de Washington
1 275 000 $1 275 000 $
DG
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo de Capitals de Washington
4 000 000 $4 000 000 $
DD
UFA - 2
Logo de Capitals de Washington
925 000 $925 000 $ (Bonis de performance600 000 $$600K)
G
UFA - 1
Logo de Blackhawks de Chicago
3 850 000 $3 850 000 $
DD
UFA - 2
Logo de Capitals de Washington
800 000 $800 000 $
DG
UFA - 1
Logo de Capitals de Washington
800 000 $800 000 $
DD
UFA - 1
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
Logo de Capitals de Washington
2 500 000 $2 500 000 $
DG
UFA - 2

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23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 9
#1
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thought this was an actual Kane offer after all the ones I've seen on here
Eli a aimé ceci.
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 10
#2
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Quoting: Hedman77
thought this was an actual Kane offer after all the ones I've seen on here


Hey, you gotta pay in the currency they're asking.
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23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 13
#3
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I still don't think it's enough
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23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 16
#4
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Quoting: Barbs
I still don't think it's enough


It will never be enough, but the league doesn't sign off on this one because it puts Chicago one over the 50 contract limit. They can certainly dump back a minor leaguer, though. smile

eta: what would you want added?
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 20
#5
DaBus
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Lmao... quality over quantity. McMichael would have to come back the other way
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 21
#6
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Add a 4th rounder and Chicago says yes
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 21
#7
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Quoting: DaBus
Lmao... quality over quantity. McMichael would have to come back the other way


McMichael is 19 and 6'0" and had a junior season that projects as a 52 point NHL campaign, this year.

Another guy is 19 and 6'0" and had a junior season that projects as a 52 point season this year: Alexis Lafreniere (edit: sorry. Just 50. Got confused).

Get outta here with that noise.
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 23
#8
DaBus
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Quoting: Eli
McMichael is 19 and 6'0" and had a junior season that projects as a 52 point NHL campaign, this year.

Another guy is 19 and 6'0" and had a junior season that projects as a 52 point season this year: Alexis Lafreniere (edit: sorry. Just 50. Got confused).

Get outta here with that noise.


That proposed offer above is a joke lmao. Hawks not retaining 5M to take three cap dumps and to only include two decent prospects and a 1st rounder that would be late. Not to mention Murphy is also in the deal too
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 24
#9
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Quoting: Eli
It will never be enough, but the league doesn't sign off on this one because it puts Chicago one over the 50 contract limit. They can certainly dump back a minor leaguer, though. smile

eta: what would you want added?


McMichael and it would be worth it. Kane and Ovechkin on the powerplay would be stupid fun to watch
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 30
#10
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Quoting: Eli
McMichael is 19 and 6'0" and had a junior season that projects as a 52 point NHL campaign, this year.

Another guy is 19 and 6'0" and had a junior season that projects as a 52 point season this year: Alexis Lafreniere (edit: sorry. Just 50. Got confused).

Get outta here with that noise.


Did you just compare McMichael to Lafreniere? Also not sure where you got those point projections from. McMichael was on pace for 133 points and Lafreniere was on pace for 146. McMichael was surrounded with decent prospects while Lafreniere made the players around him better. While they are both technically 19, McMichael is 10 months older than Lafreniere. In addition at the WJC McMichael had 1 point per game while Lafreniere had 2 points per game. He's a solid prospect, but don't compare him Lafreniere again.
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23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 31
#11
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Quoting: DaBus
That proposed offer above is a joke lmao. Hawks not retaining 5M to take three cap dumps and to only include two decent prospects and a 1st rounder that would be late.


Aren't cap dumps supposed to be worse than average players, not currently living up to their contracts, though?

Because Oshie was on pace for 31g 59p last year, and was a top 30 RW by even strength points.

Panik finished last year with 20 points in his last 36 games, a 45 point pace, once he got out of Reirden's doghouse.

Jensen is one of the best penalty killers, and could play bigger minutes but Carlson.

The cap has to balance, and then the picks and prospects only have to cover the difference in value. Kane will turn 32 by the time the season starts. He'll decline for three years and then likely sign back in Chicago for a victory lap. He might help WSH win a Cup, but it's not like they can't win it with the guys they have.

Quoting: Cdn_bacon
Add a 4th rounder and Chicago says yes


You know what? Make it TWO fourths! smile
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 32
#12
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Quoting: Barbs
McMichael and it would be worth it. Kane and Ovechkin on the powerplay would be stupid fun to watch


Big nope. McMichael and Ovechkin on the power play would be just as good by the end of Kane's contract. And McMicahel will still be just getting started. Other ideas?
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 47
#13
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Kane with $2M retention for Ovechkin and a 1st.
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 57
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Modifié 23 oct. 2020 à 16 h 15
Quoting: Club_de_Hockey_le_Canadien
Did you just compare McMichael to Lafreniere? Also not sure where you got those point projections from. McMichael was on pace for 133 points and Lafreniere was on pace for 146. McMichael was surrounded with decent prospects while Lafreniere made the players around him better. While they are both technically 19, McMichael is 10 months older than Lafreniere. In addition at the WJC McMichael had 1 point per game while Lafreniere had 2 points per game. He's a solid prospect, but don't compare him Lafreniere again.


Feed their stats into this little machine, and McMichael is currently more productive relative to league difficulty: https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/frozenpool_nhle.php

You're right that age means Lafreniere has a higher ceiling. Where you make a quality of teammates argument about Lafreniere in juniors and then ignore that he played top line and PP1 with NHLer Barrett Hayton at Worlds, you kinda lost me.


edit: they're just under nine months apart in age, though. That's beyond debate.
23 oct. 2020 à 15 h 58
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Quoting: tkecanuck341
Kane with $2M retention for Ovechkin and a 1st.


Add more retention, and WSH might consider if they're worried about re-signing Ovechkin next summer? But Ovechkin still doesn't waive for Chicago. Need a third team. LA interested? smile
23 oct. 2020 à 16 h 1
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Quoting: Eli
Add more retention, and WSH might consider if they're worried about re-signing Ovechkin next summer? But Ovechkin still doesn't waive for Chicago. Need a third team. LA interested? smile


Interested in what?
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23 oct. 2020 à 16 h 3
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Quoting: tkecanuck341
Interested in what?


I'm just having fun. I have no idea what teams Ovechkin has on his list. But it seems like a lot of guys are okay with living on the beach.
23 oct. 2020 à 17 h 4
#18
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Quoting: Eli
Feed their stats into this little machine, and McMichael is currently more productive relative to league difficulty: https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/frozenpool_nhle.php

You're right that age means Lafreniere has a higher ceiling. Where you make a quality of teammates argument about Lafreniere in juniors and then ignore that he played top line and PP1 with NHLer Barrett Hayton at Worlds, you kinda lost me.


edit: they're just under nine months apart in age, though. That's beyond debate.


Yes, Lafreniere did have better linemates at the WJC but he was on that line above McMichael because the coaches trusted him (a younger player) more. As for translation rates across leagues, I don't trust them at all. I've experimented with way too many variations of NHLe and other translation factors because the estimations are substantially off from player to player. Some players translate better while others play a very different game when placed on a lower spot in the depth chart. The amount of high level prospects from junior leagues who have gone to the AHL and not been able to maintain their high scoring rates is incredible but not surprising. What's more important in my opinion is the percentage of prospects coming from junior leagues who maintain their production. The second edition of Stat Shot by Rob Vollman does a better job than me of explaining the importance of age in translation factors from junior leagues.
23 oct. 2020 à 18 h 39
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Quoting: Eli
McMichael is 19 and 6'0" and had a junior season that projects as a 52 point NHL campaign, this year.

Another guy is 19 and 6'0" and had a junior season that projects as a 52 point season this year: Alexis Lafreniere (edit: sorry. Just 50. Got confused).

Get outta here with that noise.


50 points? So half the amount of points as Kane?
23 oct. 2020 à 19 h 0
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Quoting: Club_de_Hockey_le_Canadien
Yes, Lafreniere did have better linemates at the WJC but he was on that line above McMichael because the coaches trusted him (a younger player) more. As for translation rates across leagues, I don't trust them at all. I've experimented with way too many variations of NHLe and other translation factors because the estimations are substantially off from player to player. Some players translate better while others play a very different game when placed on a lower spot in the depth chart. The amount of high level prospects from junior leagues who have gone to the AHL and not been able to maintain their high scoring rates is incredible but not surprising. What's more important in my opinion is the percentage of prospects coming from junior leagues who maintain their production. The second edition of Stat Shot by Rob Vollman does a better job than me of explaining the importance of age in translation factors from junior leagues.


Yeah. Points based metrics have huge variability anyway, but when you add in a lot of prospects coming from leagues that don't publicize whether points happened on a power play or not, it's all ridiculously unreliable. Age is important, but it's basically impossible to guess which of Lafreniere/McMichael is better right now, without any idea of how they got their points.

As for the depth chart, yes, it's impressive that both guys were in the top six as 18 year olds on a 20 and under team. I'm not too down about McMichael slotting a line behind Hayton, who had been picked 5th overall and playeMcMichael probably ends up back in the OHL this year because WSH is trying to win the Cup. And Because of that Lafreniere develops faster and in a year, you look right. But right now, they're about even.
23 oct. 2020 à 19 h 2
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Quoting: Breadmanhawks
50 points? So half the amount of points as Kane?


Yes. At 18-19, he was about half as good as Kane. In three years, they should be about even, and then Kane leaves as a UFA, or McMichael signs an 8 year extension to last until he's 30.
23 oct. 2020 à 19 h 19
#22
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Quoting: Eli
Yes. At 18-19, he was about half as good as Kane. In three years, they should be about even, and then Kane leaves as a UFA, or McMichael signs an 8 year extension to last until he's 30.


Lol in 3 years they should be even. Sure edmonton fans were saying that about Yakupov. Sorry you don’t get elite talent for “should be even”
23 oct. 2020 à 19 h 24
#23
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Quoting: Breadmanhawks
Lol in 3 years they should be even. Sure edmonton fans were saying that about Yakupov. Sorry you don’t get elite talent for “should be even”


Edmonton also thought that about McDavid, and look how that turned out, though. Try trading Kane for him, now.
23 oct. 2020 à 19 h 27
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Quoting: Eli
Edmonton also thought that about McDavid, and look how that turned out, though. Try trading Kane for him, now.


On another episode of fan bases overrating their prospects that never played a single game.

So now Connor McMichael is a McDavid level prospect?

Also, I don’t know if you know how it works but, that’s kind of the risk.
23 oct. 2020 à 19 h 29
#25
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Quoting: Breadmanhawks
On another episode of fan bases overrating their prospects that never played a single game.

So now Connor McMichael is a McDavid level prospect?

Also, I don’t know if you know how it works but, that’s kind of the risk.


Caps fans have heard of Forsberg. Yes. That is indeed how it works.
 
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