Forums/Armchair-GM

Formenton

Créé par: Richard88
Date de création initiale: sep 7, 2020
Publié: 7 sep à 18 h 59
Équipe: 2020-21 Avalanche du Colorado
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
RFAANSCAP HIT
Burakovsky, André45 000 000 $
Nichushkin, Valeri22 000 000 $
O'Connor, Logan2875 000 $
Zadorov, Nikita13 200 000 $
Transactions
COL
  1. Formenton, Alex
  2. 2020 2e round pick (CBJ)
OTT
  1. Graves, Ryan [Droits de RFA]
COL
  1. 2020 2e round pick (FLA)
  2. 2021 3e round pick (FLA)
FLA
  1. Jost, Tyson [Droits de RFA]
COL
  1. Bonino, Nick
NSH
  1. Mutala, Sasha [Liste de réserve]
  2. 2020 2e round pick (CBJ)
ANNÉE DE REPÊCHAGERONDE 1RONDE 2RONDE 3RONDE 4RONDE 5RONDE 6RONDE 7
2020
COL
FLA
TOR
COL
COL
FLA
COL
2021
COL
COL
COL
FLA
COL
COL
COL
2022
COL
COL
COL
COL
COL
COL
COL
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS BONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2281 500 000 $76 993 095 $0 $5 425 000 $4 506 905 $

Formation

Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
COL
Landeskog, Gabriel
5 571 429 $
AG
NTC
UFA - 1
COL
MacKinnon, Nathan
6 300 000 $
C, AD
NTC
UFA - 3
COL
Rantanen, Mikko
9 250 000 $
AD
UFA - 5
COL
Burakovsky, André
5 000 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 2
COL
Kadri, Nazem
4 500 000 $
C
NTC
UFA - 2
COL
Donskoi, Joonas
3 900 000 $
AD
UFA - 3
COL
Nichushkin, Valeri
2 000 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 2
NSH
Bonino, Nick
4 100 000 $
C
UFA - 1
COL
Compher, J.T.
3 500 000 $
AD, C
UFA - 3
COL
Calvert, Matt
2 850 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 1
COL
Bellemare, Pierre-Édouard
1 800 000 $
AG, C
UFA - 1
COL
Kaut, Martin
863 333 $
AD
RFA - 3
COL
O'Connor, Logan
875 000 $
AD
RFA - 2
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
COL
Girard, Samuel
5 000 000 $
DG
UFA - 7
COL
Makar, Cale
880 833 $
DD
RFA - 1
COL
Grubauer, Philipp
3 333 333 $
G
UFA - 1
COL
Byram, Bowen
894 167 $
DG
RFA - 3
COL
Johnson, Erik
6 000 000 $
DD
NMC NTC
UFA - 3
COL
Francouz, Pavel
2 000 000 $
G
UFA - 2
COL
Zadorov, Nikita
3 200 000 $
DG/DD
RFA - 1
COL
Timmins, Conor
925 000 $
DD
RFA - 1
COL
Cole, Ian
4 250 000 $
DG/DD
UFA - 1
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
COL
Bowers, Shane
925 000 $
C
RFA - 2
OTT
Formenton, Alex
747 500 $
AG
RFA - 2

Unités spéciales

Avantage numérique 1
MacKinnon, N.
Landeskog, G.
Rantanen, M.
Kadri, N.
Makar, C.
Avantage numérique 2
Kaut, M.
Bonino, N.
Burakovsky, A.
Girard, S.
Byram, B.
Infériorité numérique 1
Bonino, N.
Donskoi, J.
Byram, B.
Johnson, E.
Infériorité numérique 2
Bellemare, P.
Calvert, M.
Zadorov, N.
Timmins, C.

Code d'intégration

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Texte intégré

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7 sep à 19 h 07
#1
Rejoint: oct 2019
Messages: 1,895
Mentions "j'aime": 530
I do not like the idea of trading Formenton...

But golly do I like Graves.
Richard88 a aimé ceci.
7 sep à 19 h 07
#2
Rejoint: jun 2019
Messages: 622
Mentions "j'aime": 235
Ottawa is eager to see Formenton play next year. They won't trade him for Graves 1 for 1.
BadTradePolice a aimé ceci.
7 sep à 19 h 10
#3
tag me in bad trades
Rejoint: déc 2019
Messages: 556
Mentions "j'aime": 227
no
7 sep à 19 h 14
#4
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
Mentions "j'aime": 1,461
Quoting: yeeeeeeeeeetttt
no

yes
7 sep à 19 h 14
#5
Rejoint: jan 2018
Messages: 9,140
Mentions "j'aime": 4,726
I look at Formenton, and I see so much of what the Sens want their identity as a team to be, that I can't see him being moved. He plays fast, he has skill, but more importantly he plays a 200ft game, kills penalties and is just annoying to play against which are things the Sens clearly value.

I like Graves, but they should be able to get a deal done without moving a guy like that. If not, I would just target someone else.
7 sep à 19 h 15
#6
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
Mentions "j'aime": 1,461
Quoting: Ste_Catherine_Street
Ottawa is eager to see Formenton play next year. They won't trade him for Graves 1 for 1.


They also need LHD right away and likely use their top draft picks on forwards/RHD this year.
7 sep à 19 h 17
#7
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
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Quoting: Claesson4Norris
I look at Formenton, and I see so much of what the Sens want their identity as a team to be, that I can't see him being moved. He plays fast, he has skill, but more importantly he plays a 200ft game, kills penalties and is just annoying to play against which are things the Sens clearly value.

I like Graves, but they should be able to get a deal done without moving a guy like that. If not, I would just target someone else.

Formenton would fit Colorado's play style as well though lol

Out of curiosity, what would you be willing to move for Graves if Formenton isn't included?
7 sep à 19 h 17
#8
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Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
Mentions "j'aime": 1,461
Quoting: PLDGEY
I do not like the idea of trading Formenton...

But golly do I like Graves.


What would you offer for Graves?
7 sep à 19 h 22
#9
Rejoint: jun 2019
Messages: 622
Mentions "j'aime": 235
Quoting: Richard88
They also need LHD right away and likely use their top draft picks on forwards/RHD this year.


Sure, I agree they need LHD. But Formenton is 1 of their 3 best prospects. Their other two are RHD. I don't see Ottawa taking Drysdale, they may take Sanderson instead.
If they do trade for a LHD, there are many other options they can go for.
In this deal, Colorado is dealing from a position of weakness because they have so many D, they need to get rid of one and Ottawa doesn't necessarily want to trade their best FWD prospect for a 25 yr old with 95 games of NHL experience.
Keep in mind I'm an AVS fan here.
7 sep à 19 h 24
#10
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Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
Mentions "j'aime": 1,461
Quoting: Ste_Catherine_Street
Sure, I agree they need LHD. But Formenton is 1 of their 3 best prospects. Their other two are RHD. I don't see Ottawa taking Drysdale, they may take Sanderson instead.
If they do trade for a LHD, there are many other options they can go for.
In this deal, Colorado is dealing from a position of weakness because they have so many D, they need to get rid of one and Ottawa doesn't necessarily want to trade their best FWD prospect for a 25 yr old with 95 games of NHL experience.
Keep in mind I'm an AVS fan here.

Fair points.

Avs aren't trading from a position of weakness though. Yes we have plenty of Dmen, but that doesn't mean that it's a weakness. We have plenty of capspace and can easily just resign everyone we have. Now, if we were in Tampa's position right up against the cap and being forced to move someone, that's trading from a position of weakness.
7 sep à 19 h 24
#11
Rejoint: jun 2019
Messages: 622
Mentions "j'aime": 235
Quoting: Richard88
What would you offer for Graves?


If I were Ott and I REALLY wanted Graves, I'd offer either the NYI 1st rounder OR Lassi Thomsonn or Branstrom (their two RHD prospects)
7 sep à 19 h 28
#12
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Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
Mentions "j'aime": 1,461
Quoting: Ste_Catherine_Street
If I were Ott and I REALLY wanted Graves, I'd offer either the NYI 1st rounder OR Lassi Thomsonn or Branstrom (their two RHD prospects)


I think Graves' value is probably about where Avs 1st is, a 24th overall pick.

The NYI 1st (28-31) would be interesting but I still feel that it falls slightly short.

Lassi Thomson hasn't had a smooth development and I don't think he's the type of Dman we need. Brannstrom would be too good to pass up though, but I doubt Ottawa offers him considering that he was the centerpiece of the Stone return.
7 sep à 19 h 28
#13
Rejoint: jun 2019
Messages: 622
Mentions "j'aime": 235
Quoting: Richard88
Fair points.

Avs aren't trading from a position of weakness though. Yes we have plenty of Dmen, but that doesn't mean that it's a weakness. We have plenty of capspace and can easily just resign everyone we have. Now, if we were in Tampa's position right up against the cap and being forced to move someone, that's trading from a position of weakness.


Yea I get what you mean true. I'm just super exited to see what Col does this offseason if Byram and/or Timmins are ready to play. I think Colorado can have the best defense in the league the next 10 years. Like Chicago of the 2008-2015 cycle
Richard88 a aimé ceci.
7 sep à 19 h 29
#14
tag me in bad trades
Rejoint: déc 2019
Messages: 556
Mentions "j'aime": 227
no
7 sep à 19 h 29
#15
tag me in bad trades
Rejoint: déc 2019
Messages: 556
Mentions "j'aime": 227
Quoting: Richard88
yes


no
7 sep à 19 h 30
#16
Rejoint: mai 2015
Messages: 347
Mentions "j'aime": 72
Modifié 7 sep à 19 h 43
DELETE
7 sep à 19 h 34
#17
Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 1,759
Mentions "j'aime": 507
formenton and a 2nd? that's a nice package.
Richard88 a aimé ceci.
7 sep à 19 h 43
#18
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
Mentions "j'aime": 1,461
Quoting: yeeeeeeeeeetttt
no


yes
7 sep à 19 h 46
#19
Rejoint: mai 2015
Messages: 347
Mentions "j'aime": 72
Quoting: Ste_Catherine_Street
Sure, I agree they need LHD. But Formenton is 1 of their 3 best prospects. Their other two are RHD. I don't see Ottawa taking Drysdale, they may take Sanderson instead.
If they do trade for a LHD, there are many other options they can go for.
In this deal, Colorado is dealing from a position of weakness because they have so many D, they need to get rid of one and Ottawa doesn't necessarily want to trade their best FWD prospect for a 25 yr old with 95 games of NHL experience.
Keep in mind I'm an AVS fan here.


Quoting: Richard88
What would you offer for Graves?


I have to disagree... see below

1. 3rd Overall (2020)
2. 5th Overall (2020)
3. Drake Batherson (RW/C)
4. Josh Norris (C)
5. Erik Brannstrom (RHD)
6. Logan Brown (C)
7. Jacob Bernard-Docker (RHD)
8. Alex Formenton (LW)
9. 28/30/31 Overall (2020)
10. Lassi Thomson (RHD)

and I expect that to change between the final game of the Stanley Cup playoffs to draft day due to flatcap and the ratio buyers/sellers associated with it. Also looking at the latest mock drafts and also how the NY Islanders are doing looks like we're having 3, 5 28-31. Even though the consensus at the moment seems to be between 4 players (3: Stutzle/Byfield // 5: Perfetti/Raymond)

So as for OP, would you take the offer below

Ryan Graves (LHD)
2020-1st (24/COL)

Alex Formenton (LW)
2020-2nd (51/CBJ)
2020-2nd (58/NYI)
2020-3rd (70/WPG)
7 sep à 19 h 47
#20
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
Mentions "j'aime": 1,461
Quoting: alpine4life
I have to disagree... see below

1. 3rd Overall (2020)
2. 5th Overall (2020)
3. Drake Batherson (RW/C)
4. Josh Norris (C)
5. Erik Brannstrom (RHD)
6. Logan Brown (C)
7. Jacob Bernard-Docker (RHD)
8. Alex Formenton (LW)
9. 28/30/31 Overall (2020)
10. Lassi Thomson (RHD)

and I expect that to change between the final game of the Stanley Cup playoffs to draft day due to flatcap and the ratio buyers/sellers associated with it. Also looking at the latest mock drafts and also how the NY Islanders are doing looks like we're having 3, 5 28-31. Even though the consensus at the moment seems to be between 4 players (3: Stutzle/Byfield // 5: Perfetti/Raymond)

So as for OP, would you take the offer below

Ryan Graves (LHD)
2020-1st (24/COL)

Alex Formenton (LW)
2020-2nd (51/CBJ)
2020-2nd (58/NYI)
2020-3rd (70/WPG)


I would absolutely decline that offer, not even close.

Colorado would be giving up the 2 best assets in the deal, and the draft pick value difference between #24 and late 2nd/3rd rounders is huge.

For example, trading from 29 to 24 typically costs a late 2nd.
7 sep à 19 h 48
#21
Rejoint: jan 2018
Messages: 9,140
Mentions "j'aime": 4,726
Quoting: Richard88
Formenton would fit Colorado's play style as well though lol

Out of curiosity, what would you be willing to move for Graves if Formenton isn't included?


I really don't know how to evaluate Ryan Graves. There's a lot to like there, but I would like to see a larger sample size before I'd be comfortable making a big offer for a guy like that.
7 sep à 20 h 04
#22
Rejoint: mai 2015
Messages: 347
Mentions "j'aime": 72
Quoting: Richard88
I would absolutely decline that offer, not even close.

Colorado would be giving up the 2 best assets in the deal, and the draft pick value difference between #24 and late 2nd/3rd rounders is huge.

For example, trading from 29 to 24 typically costs a late 2nd.


Ryan Graves (LHD)
2020-1st (24/COL)

Alex Formenton (LW)
2020-2nd (34/OTT)
2020-2nd (58/NYI)
2020-3rd (70/WPG)

this?
7 sep à 20 h 14
#23
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
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Quoting: alpine4life
Ryan Graves (LHD)
2020-1st (24/COL)

Alex Formenton (LW)
2020-2nd (34/OTT)
2020-2nd (58/NYI)
2020-3rd (70/WPG)

this?


Better, but still not there.

Moving from 34 to 29 costs an early 3rd (let's say 70).
Moving from 29 to 24 costs a late 2nd (let's say 58).

So on the balance there you have our 1st for your 3 picks; and then Formenton for Graves 1-for-1. That doesn't cut it.

Honestly any trade that involves trading down from 24 isn't of any interest. We're a contender looking to consolidate assets, not dilute the highest draft pick we're likely to have for the foreseeable future.

I'm not even sure it makes sense to move Graves, at least not until Byram has established himself. We're also better off letting Graves prove himself for another season to really establish his trade value before moving him on.

I'd move him if the right deal was there - and by right deal I mean a deal that probably favours Colorado a bit. And with that #24 pick I'm looking to move up, not down.
30 sep à 21 h 19
#24
NoMontourRistoBarrie
Rejoint: aoû 2019
Messages: 2,271
Mentions "j'aime": 538
Ryan Graves doesn’t fetch that package......
1 oct à 6 h 16
#25
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: avr 2020
Messages: 4,779
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Quoting: DavidAyers
Ryan Graves doesn’t fetch that package......


Why not? He's a young top 4 Dman who's going to be very cheap to resign. Granted, he only has like 120 NHL games or so, but he's not a streaky player and plays a steady game so there's no reason why he can't keep up his play from the first 120 games going forwards.

I would think that a cheap top 4 Dman like him would be attractive to plenty of teams, both contenders as well as budget teams like Ottawa. Colorado would gladly keep him, but we also have a log-jam at LHD so something has to give between him, Zadorov, and Cole.
 
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