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what would you do with the 15th pick

28 août 2020 à 11 h 34
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28 août 2020 à 11 h 36
#2
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Draft a D unless its part of a huge upgrade on D with term
28 août 2020 à 11 h 37
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Trade it for Kasperi Kapanen
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28 août 2020 à 11 h 40
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trade down
28 août 2020 à 11 h 45
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Quoting: kous
Draft a D unless its part of a huge upgrade on D with term


who would you draft. I don't disagree.

In my opinon, I would consider reaching a bit for Helge Grans at 15, but I would not reach for Schneider, Guhle or Wallinder, Barron or O'Rourke.

To draft one of those guys, I'd trade down 10 spots or so.
28 août 2020 à 11 h 45
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Quoting: Gordon_Bombay
who would you draft. I don't disagree.

In my opinon, I would consider reaching a bit for Helge Grans at 15, but I would not reach for Schneider, Guhle or Wallinder, Barron or O'Rourke.

To draft one of those guys, I'd trade down 10 spots or so.


Schneider might be gone a pick after yours, and he’s the perfect guy. Take him
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28 août 2020 à 11 h 49
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Quoting: HabsFan9
Schneider might be gone a pick after yours, and he’s the perfect guy. Take him


Then I would let the team after 15 pick him to be honest
28 août 2020 à 11 h 53
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Quoting: Gordon_Bombay
Then I would let the team after 15 pick him to be honest


dude, sometimes you have to reach in a draft to find your coveted player. It happens all the time(KK, Seider, etc,). If you pick Schneider, we’ll all be talking about how Dubas was a great GM in ten years
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28 août 2020 à 11 h 53
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if i keep the pick, hope Lundell falls to 15, if he doesnt then Quinn.
if there is a top 5ish guy who is plumeting like Barzal (see Rossi in some mocks) i try to trade up for them, and since it's a deep draft and more than a few GM's will be eyeing up trade down for asset deals that should be not too hard
if there is no falling player, and i want to trade back, i aim for the 20th or so pick and try to get Jarvis or Ghule and another 2nd or something
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28 août 2020 à 11 h 55
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Quoting: HabsFan9
dude, sometimes you have to reach in a draft to find your coveted player. It happens all the time(KK, Seider, etc,). If you pick Schneider, we’ll all be talking about how Dubas was a great GM in ten years


unless you pick that guy over this drafts version of Brady Tkachuk, Quinn Hughes, or Dylan Cozens because then people will be "why the hell did you reach for that guy?"
28 août 2020 à 11 h 56
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no way leafs should trade down if all they get is a second round pick to move down around 15 spots
28 août 2020 à 11 h 58
#12
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
unless you pick that guy over this drafts version of Brady Tkachuk, Quinn Hughes, or Dylan Cozens because then people will be "why the hell did you reach for that guy?"


Say what you want about KK, we’ll discuss that another time. Just to make it clear, there are no Brady Tkachuks, Quinn Hughes, or Dylan Cozens available at 15th overall.
28 août 2020 à 11 h 59
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Quoting: HabsFan9
Say what you want about KK, we’ll discuss that another time. Just to make it clear, there are no Brady Tkachuks, Quinn Hughes, or Dylan Cozens available at 15th overall.


and there are no KK's or Seider's available after that either, so what's your point?
28 août 2020 à 12 h 2
#14
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
and there are no KK's or Seider's available after that either, so what's your point?


my point is that’s teams usually look good after reaching a bit for a guy that they need and are really high on. For the sake of your fan base, I hope you take Schneider
28 août 2020 à 12 h 5
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Quoting: HabsFan9
my point is that’s teams usually look good after reaching a bit for a guy that they need and are really high on. For the sake of your fan base, I hope you take Schneider


except reaching is almost always a bad idea and generally works out poorly for the team who does it because, like your examples, they end up with a worse player than those they reached over no matter how good it turns out.
You should always take the player you think is the best player and not reach for someone just because they fit a current missing asset, especially when you are drafting outside the top 5 and the guy you are taking wont even be ready to fill that roster spot for 4-5 years. For all we know the leafs could have an utterly stacked RD by then and Schneider wont have a spot to play and they'll desperately need an RW.
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28 août 2020 à 12 h 5
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If you think a guy only has 3rd pair upside he's probably not worth using even a late 1st round pick on, honestly given where the Leafs are at if they can turn that 15th overall pick into a much needed dman or whatever then they should probably make that trade.
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28 août 2020 à 12 h 6
#17
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Quoting: JaredOfLondon
except reaching is almost always a bad idea and generally works out poorly for the team who does it because, like your examples, they end up with a worse player than those they reached over no matter how good it turns out.
You should always take the player you think is the best player and not reach for someone just because they fit a current missing asset, especially when you are drafting outside the top 5 and the guy you are taking wont even be ready to fill that roster spot for 4-5 years. For all we know the leafs could have an utterly stacked RD by then and Schneider wont have a spot to play and they'll desperately need an RW.


it’s a fair point, not necessarily a right one. Who do you see being available at 15, then
28 août 2020 à 12 h 7
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Quoting: HabsFan9
dude, sometimes you have to reach in a draft to find your coveted player. It happens all the time(KK, Seider, etc,). If you pick Schneider, we’ll all be talking about how Dubas was a great GM in ten years


Quoting: JaredOfLondon
and there are no KK's or Seider's available after that either, so what's your point?


As mentioned by someone else in another attempt to draft. I quite liked his comparison. Schneider is kind of a Luke Schenn pick. Strong, physical, mature beyond his years which makes him look great in the WHL, but lacks skill, agility, mobility and skating, which I think will make it extremely different to overcome in the NHL, leading to nothing more than a 3rd pair D.

Players with little mobility get bured quite often in the NHL, because most forwards are mobile and can skate and stickhandle.

Quoting: JaredOfLondon
and there are no KK's or Seider's available after that either, so what's your point?


I think this is quite a different thing. I think for KK and Seider (I don't think it was a reach to be honest) They saw a lot of raw skills that can be developed, which I think is quite different to Schneider
28 août 2020 à 12 h 10
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Quoting: Gordon_Bombay
As mentioned by someone else in another attempt to draft. I quite liked his comparison. Schneider is kind of a Luke Schenn pick. Strong, physical, mature beyond his years which makes him look great in the WHL, but lacks skill, agility, mobility and skating, which I think will make it extremely different to overcome in the NHL, leading to nothing more than a 3rd pair D.

Players with little mobility get bured quite often in the NHL, because most forwards are mobile and can skate and stickhandle.



I think this is quite a different thing. I think for KK and Seider (I don't think it was a reach to be honest) They saw a lot of raw skills that can be developed, which I think is quite different to Schneider


yeah, lots of people are drooling over some of Schneider's raw physical abilities and ignoring that he has some pretty serious warts in his game. There's a reason he's rated so low as a big mobile defender.
28 août 2020 à 12 h 15
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Quoting: MisstheWhalers
If you think a guy only has 3rd pair upside he's probably not worth using even a late 1st round pick on, honestly given where the Leafs are at if they can turn that 15th overall pick into a much needed dman or whatever then they should probably make that trade.


That is a fair question. On the other hand, a lot of hockey related research has shown how past picks developed, and it is not that great at the end of the first round.

So the question is, do you take a player at 25-31 who has a 75% percent chance of becoming a 3rd pairing D and a 10% chance of becoming a top 4, or do you take a gample of saying he has a 30% chance of becoming a good top 4D, but also a 70% chance of never making it to the NHL.

For me, I'd take that chance on a Gunler this year. I think he has a good chance of becoming a good top 6 forward, but also a good chance of never making it to the NHL
28 août 2020 à 12 h 33
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Schneider just seems to be Luke Schenn 2.0
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28 août 2020 à 12 h 43
#22
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Quoting: Gordon_Bombay
That is a fair question. On the other hand, a lot of hockey related research has shown how past picks developed, and it is not that great at the end of the first round.

So the question is, do you take a player at 25-31 who has a 75% percent chance of becoming a 3rd pairing D and a 10% chance of becoming a top 4, or do you take a gample of saying he has a 30% chance of becoming a good top 4D, but also a 70% chance of never making it to the NHL.

For me, I'd take that chance on a Gunler this year. I think he has a good chance of becoming a good top 6 forward, but also a good chance of never making it to the NHL


If you look at drafts over the last 10 or so years there's hits and misses in almost every round to some degree, kind of depends on how big a reach a guy is I guess, sometimes I think it might just all be luck but then you look at Tampa and they've done really well in later rounds 2 and later so who knows really.

As a Jets fan I hear often about their drafting being so good and while they have done well in their 1st round picks for the most part they haven't found anything other then 4th liners and bottom pair dmen in rounds 2-7 other then Hellebuyck in round 5 but goalies typically are drafted in later rounds so I'm not sure that's much of an accomplishment really, idk if they were reaching or not with some of those picks but the guys that did make mostly look like what we'd consider a "safe pick", I wish they'd took a chance with some of those past picks and selected a guy that might of been considered more of a risk/high upside type player.
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28 août 2020 à 14 h 5
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I love Grans (and he has a higher upside than Sanderson imo) but I would say Jurmo Andrae and definitely Wallinder have higher ceilings (and 100% not Schneider Guhle or Barron)
28 août 2020 à 14 h 44
#24
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Quoting: Dan10900
I love Grans (and he has a higher upside than Sanderson imo) but I would say Jurmo Andrae and definitely Wallinder have higher ceilings (and 100% not Schneider Guhle or Barron)


Seems like someone follows the SHL and the Liiga applaud

Hard to say on the first one. Not sure if I would agree with Wallinder having a higher ceiling. And honestly, I don't know Jurmo well enough to actually make a judgement on him. I think with Andrae there will always be the questionmark in terms of his size. I think he will be selected somewhere in the 2nd round and the team that picks him will either look like a genius or not so much
28 août 2020 à 14 h 52
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Quoting: Gordon_Bombay
Seems like someone follows the SHL and the Liiga applaud

Hard to say on the first one. Not sure if I would agree with Wallinder having a higher ceiling. And honestly, I don't know Jurmo well enough to actually make a judgement on him. I think with Andrae there will always be the questionmark in terms of his size. I think he will be selected somewhere in the 2nd round and the team that picks him will either look like a genius or not so much


Wallinder is like a Broberg to me (but better), just a physical freak, and a super smooth skater, but he's a massive risk of just not becoming an NHLer, Jurmo is similar, but not quite as high a ceiling imo
 
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