Forums/Armchair-GM

Trading Down - Hear me out

Créé par: arafay
Date de création initiale: aoû 10, 2020
Publié: 10 aoû à 23 h 11
Équipe: 2020-21 Jets de Winnipeg
Explications
Consider the top 9 goes something like:
Lafreniere, stutzle, Byfield, perfetti, Raymond, drysdale, Rossi, holtz, lundell. Now with lundell gone and the jets on the board with Sanderson, askarov, and Quinn all still on the board do the jets trade down? If I’m the jets I do. So make a deal with New Jersey so they can nab sanderson/Quinn and we get more picks and land somewhere better for centres. I think in this scenario, one of Holloway or zary get taken by Florida. I think it’s honestly a coin toss because who knows what Florida will do. However, if zary isn’t taken, I don’t see him being picked until 18 as there aren’t any other teams in the middle with a glaring need at c. So, we are left with a choice of zary, Lapierre, bourque, and perreault. I think the jets take lapierre. With 20 they take baron.

I know some fans will say that they should take zary, but I honestly think lapierre is and will be better. This is much like when the jets drafted Kyle Connor. The jets picked the guy with more skill then, and I think they do the same here.

I also know that fellow jets fans say that don’t take the chance of moving down, but if we can get 2 first rounders and solve both the long term rd and 2c issues in one draft, I think the jets do it no questions asked. I know it’s always risky to move down, but the jets only need a 2c so if both zary and lapierre are gone at 18, I think they can still get that with bourque or perreault.

Of course this is dependant I f if NJ is willing to do this, however, I did get a yes from a couple of NJ fans on this site so I decided to make a thread
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
RFAANSCAP HIT
Appleton, Mason2800 000 $
Harkins, Jansen2800 000 $
Niku, Sami2800 000 $
Roslovic, Jack22 500 000 $
UFAANSCAP HIT
Brossoit, Laurent11 300 000 $
DeMelo, Dylan43 250 000 $
Edmundson, Joel33 750 000 $
Haula, Erik33 950 000 $
Shore, Nick1900 000 $
Wilson, Colin11 500 000 $
Transactions
WPG
  1. 2020 1e round pick (ARI)
  2. 2020 1e round pick (VAN)
18 oa
20 oa
NJD
  1. 2020 1e round pick (WPG)
  2. 2020 2e round pick (WPG)
10 oa
43 oa
WPG
  1. 2020 4e round pick (MIN)
MIN
  1. Stanley, Logan
  2. Perreault, Mathieu
ANNÉE DE REPÊCHAGERONDE 1RONDE 2RONDE 3RONDE 4RONDE 5RONDE 6RONDE 7
2020
ARI
VAN
MIN
WPG
WPG
2021
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
2022
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
WPG
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS BONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2381 500 000 $81 392 022 $0 $0 $107 978 $

Formation

Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
WPG
Laine, Patrik
6 750 000 $
AG, AD
RFA - 1
WPG
Scheifele, Mark
6 125 000 $
C
NTC
UFA - 4
WPG
Ehlers, Nikolaj
6 000 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 5
WPG
Connor, Kyle
7 142 857 $
AG
UFA - 6
Haula, Erik
3 950 000 $
C, AG
UFA
WPG
Wheeler, Blake
8 250 000 $
AD, C
NMC
UFA - 4
WPG
Copp, Andrew
2 280 000 $
C, AG
RFA - 1
WPG
Lowry, Adam
2 916 666 $
C
UFA - 1
WPG
Little, Bryan
5 291 666 $
C, AD
NTC
UFA - 4
Wilson, Colin
1 500 000 $
C, AG
UFA
WPG
Roslovic, Jack
2 500 000 $
AD, C
RFA
WPG
Appleton, Mason
800 000 $
AD, C
RFA
WPG
Harkins, Jansen
800 000 $
AG
RFA
WPG
Shore, Nick
900 000 $
C
UFA
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
WPG
Morrissey, Joshua
6 250 000 $
DG
UFA - 8
WPG
Pionk, Neal
3 000 000 $
DD
RFA - 1
WPG
Hellebuyck, Connor
6 166 666 $
G
UFA - 4
Edmundson, Joel
3 750 000 $
DG
NTC
UFA - 4
WPG
DeMelo, Dylan
3 250 000 $
DD
UFA
WPG
Brossoit, Laurent
1 300 000 $
G
UFA
WPG
Heinola, Ville
894 167 $
DG
RFA - 3
WPG
Poolman, Tucker
775 000 $
DD
UFA - 1
WPG
Niku, Sami
800 000 $
DD
RFA

Unités spéciales

Avantage numérique 1
Connor, K.
Scheifele, M.
Wheeler, B.
Laine, P.
Pionk, N.
Avantage numérique 2
Haula, E.
Little, B.
Roslovic, J.
Ehlers, N.
Morrissey, J.
Infériorité numérique 1
Scheifele, M.
Wheeler, B.
Morrissey, J.
DeMelo, D.
Infériorité numérique 2
Copp, A.
Lowry, A.
Edmundson, J.
Pionk, N.

Code d'intégration

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10 aoû à 23 h 27
#1
KFTW
Rejoint: jui 2018
Messages: 14,240
Mentions "j'aime": 4,617
Nah. With Sanderson, Quinn, Askarov on the board, 10th overal is valuable. Trade it somewhere for a 2C.
10 aoû à 23 h 37
#2
wpg
Rejoint: déc 2017
Messages: 942
Mentions "j'aime": 329
Just hoping for Jarvis here


That’s my 2 cents
10 aoû à 23 h 56
#3
MisstheWhalers
Rejoint: jan 2019
Messages: 10,784
Mentions "j'aime": 4,141
Man when you lay it out like that combined with the pounding the Jets took against the Flames it's pretty depressing to think of how far this team has fallen, how high the mountain is they'd have to climb to get back to contender status and with how long that will take it might be time to really blow this team up to some degree. I hate to say it and I know my fellow Jets fans will say I'm wrong but idk, this defense needs a total overhaul other then Morrissey and the D prospects they have are either too small or years away from contributing. They desperately need a 2C but that's not an easy hole to fill without creating another one and there's almost zero center prospects in the system other then Gustafsson which is pathetic, sorry to tell ya Chevy fans but I think he's pretty much failed on the draft and develop plan other then hitting on most but not all of his 1st round picks and finding Helly in the 5th round in 2012.

Honestly I think most of my past opinions on this team were wrong, it's probably time for a slight teardown/retool, there's just way too many holes to fill, some tough questions need to be asked about the direction this team is going and it might be time to part ways with some key members of the team.
tsyls et arafay a aimé ceci.
11 aoû à 0 h 03
#4
Rejoint: jun 2018
Messages: 6,929
Mentions "j'aime": 2,605
Barron sucks (so does Lapierre but I feel like we've had that argument before, I wouldn't touch either till the third)
11 aoû à 1 h 03
#5
Rejoint: jun 2019
Messages: 2,375
Mentions "j'aime": 1,030
Quoting: MisstheWhalers
Man when you lay it out like that combined with the pounding the Jets took against the Flames it's pretty depressing to think of how far this team has fallen, how high the mountain is they'd have to climb to get back to contender status and with how long that will take it might be time to really blow this team up to some degree. I hate to say it and I know my fellow Jets fans will say I'm wrong but idk, this defense needs a total overhaul other then Morrissey and the D prospects they have are either too small or years away from contributing. They desperately need a 2C but that's not an easy hole to fill without creating another one and there's almost zero center prospects in the system other then Gustafsson which is pathetic, sorry to tell ya Chevy fans but I think he's pretty much failed on the draft and develop plan other then hitting on most but not all of his 1st round picks and finding Helly in the 5th round in 2012.

Honestly I think most of my past opinions on this team were wrong, it's probably time for a slight teardown/retool, there's just way too many holes to fill, some tough questions need to be asked about the direction this team is going and it might be time to part ways with some key members of the team.


I don’t disagree with this. Too many holes to fill, If we don’t decide to tear down and retool, we’re going to end up like MIN. Always a fringe playoffs team. I wouldn’t be against an accelerated rebuild that lasts 2020-21-2022-23. I’d be fine with retooling over the next two years. Maybe tank for Wright.
arafay et MisstheWhalers a aimé ceci.
11 aoû à 2 h 29
#6
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: mar 2018
Messages: 4,509
Mentions "j'aime": 942
Quoting: MisstheWhalers
Man when you lay it out like that combined with the pounding the Jets took against the Flames it's pretty depressing to think of how far this team has fallen, how high the mountain is they'd have to climb to get back to contender status and with how long that will take it might be time to really blow this team up to some degree. I hate to say it and I know my fellow Jets fans will say I'm wrong but idk, this defense needs a total overhaul other then Morrissey and the D prospects they have are either too small or years away from contributing. They desperately need a 2C but that's not an easy hole to fill without creating another one and there's almost zero center prospects in the system other then Gustafsson which is pathetic, sorry to tell ya Chevy fans but I think he's pretty much failed on the draft and develop plan other then hitting on most but not all of his 1st round picks and finding Helly in the 5th round in 2012.

Honestly I think most of my past opinions on this team were wrong, it's probably time for a slight teardown/retool, there's just way too many holes to fill, some tough questions need to be asked about the direction this team is going and it might be time to part ways with some key members of the team.


Quoting: tsyls
I don’t disagree with this. Too many holes to fill, If we don’t decide to tear down and retool, we’re going to end up like MIN. Always a fringe playoffs team. I wouldn’t be against an accelerated rebuild that lasts 2020-21-2022-23. I’d be fine with retooling over the next two years. Maybe tank for Wright.


I don’t disagree completely with you. However, I also don’t think the jets problems are that many (big yes but not numerous). Imo the only long term need are a big top 4 rd, and a 2c. Short term, we need a big stopgap top 4 ld and a 2c. Imo we can solve both by signing haula and edmundson.

Long term, I think with these 2, the jets should be fine. Barron projects to be a top 4 shutdown rd at the very least, and lapierre a playmaking 2c. Imo both will get there in a couple of years. In the present, the jets can shore up their relative weaknesses at the tdls. I don’t see the jets’ window closed per say. However, I completely agree that the jets have 2 big holes that chevy needs to fill if we want to get back to competing.
MisstheWhalers a aimé ceci.
11 aoû à 2 h 30
#7
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: mar 2018
Messages: 4,509
Mentions "j'aime": 942
Quoting: csick
Nah. With Sanderson, Quinn, Askarov on the board, 10th overal is valuable. Trade it somewhere for a 2C.


If I’m trading the 10 oa, I’m going bigger than a 2c. I want either a top pairing rd or a 1b centre coming back.
11 aoû à 2 h 32
#8
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: mar 2018
Messages: 4,509
Mentions "j'aime": 942
Quoting: HockeyFan989
Just hoping for Jarvis here


That’s my 2 cents


same problem with why I traded down. I don’t see Jarvis as a centre and the jets definitely don’t need more wingers
MisstheWhalers a aimé ceci.
11 aoû à 10 h 12
#9
Rejoint: mar 2020
Messages: 201
Mentions "j'aime": 81
From the Devils perspective, I think the value here is solid. The chance to have two cracks at the top-10 is very enticing. The question I have is whether one of those picks could be better used in a package to acquire a top-6 winger or a top-4 defensemen from a cap-strapped team like TB. I think moving up in the draft needs to be Option 2 for NJ.
11 aoû à 12 h 46
#10
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: mar 2018
Messages: 4,509
Mentions "j'aime": 942
Quoting: DevilsFanInTX
From the Devils perspective, I think the value here is solid. The chance to have two cracks at the top-10 is very enticing. The question I have is whether one of those picks could be better used in a package to acquire a top-6 winger or a top-4 defensemen from a cap-strapped team like TB. I think moving up in the draft needs to be Option 2 for NJ.


I disagree, the wings should still rebuild. Imo use that top 10 to get a top pairing d or a top line forward instead. You can always get top 6 forwards form cap strapped teams off less than a 1st (ie Johnsson and gourde if they waive, and likely killorn)
11 aoû à 22 h 59
#11
MisstheWhalers
Rejoint: jan 2019
Messages: 10,784
Mentions "j'aime": 4,141
Quoting: tsyls
I don’t disagree with this. Too many holes to fill, If we don’t decide to tear down and retool, we’re going to end up like MIN. Always a fringe playoffs team. I wouldn’t be against an accelerated rebuild that lasts 2020-21-2022-23. I’d be fine with retooling over the next two years. Maybe tank for Wright.


Quoting: arafay
I don’t disagree completely with you. However, I also don’t think the jets problems are that many (big yes but not numerous). Imo the only long term need are a big top 4 rd, and a 2c. Short term, we need a big stopgap top 4 ld and a 2c. Imo we can solve both by signing haula and edmundson.

Long term, I think with these 2, the jets should be fine. Barron projects to be a top 4 shutdown rd at the very least, and lapierre a playmaking 2c. Imo both will get there in a couple of years. In the present, the jets can shore up their relative weaknesses at the tdls. I don’t see the jets’ window closed per say. However, I completely agree that the jets have 2 big holes that chevy needs to fill if we want to get back to competing.


The problem I see is they'll be good enough to be a bubble/wildcard team but won't be able to contend and yeah grabbing a Haula, Edmunson/Dillon as stopgaps will help but the clock is really ticking on Schiefeles prime and Wheeler already looks to be in decline so while the stopgaps help make us better and maybe a playoff team they don't make us contenders and by the time the future 2C, RHD and Samberg or Heinola come in its too late and Scheifele is declining and they're probably signing him to some contract that'll be a total anchor in no time, also the young wingers will all be in their primes but we'll have a 2C developed by then hopefully but we won't be bad enough to have sunk low enough to draft a 1C to replace Scheifele, honestly they're in a real predicament actually, they really need to decide what they're doing and make some hard choices and live with the consequences either way.
arafay a aimé ceci.
12 aoû à 15 h 05
#12
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: mar 2018
Messages: 4,509
Mentions "j'aime": 942
Modifié 12 aoû à 15 h 11
Quoting: MisstheWhalers
The problem I see is they'll be good enough to be a bubble/wildcard team but won't be able to contend and yeah grabbing a Haula, Edmunson/Dillon as stopgaps will help but the clock is really ticking on Schiefeles prime and Wheeler already looks to be in decline so while the stopgaps help make us better and maybe a playoff team they don't make us contenders and by the time the future 2C, RHD and Samberg or Heinola come in its too late and Scheifele is declining and they're probably signing him to some contract that'll be a total anchor in no time, also the young wingers will all be in their primes but we'll have a 2C developed by then hopefully but we won't be bad enough to have sunk low enough to draft a 1C to replace Scheifele, honestly they're in a real predicament actually, they really need to decide what they're doing and make some hard choices and live with the consequences either way.


Imo, they get haula since he can be a 50 pt 2c (all the jets need really). Edmundson is much better than most think. Imo he is a top 4 shutdown d-man. He should shore up the d. If the jets want to improve there at the tdl, they could add a guy like petry (if available). That’s said, I think with Edmundson, the d is at least average and he adds the much needed size. By the time his contract is up, heinola and Samberg will be at least top 4 and either haula will be up for a new contract or he will be reduced to a 3rd line role by whoever the jets draft or by Roslovic.

Imo, the jets should consider moving parts to get the 2c now, but they shouldn’t overpay (ie moving the 2020 1st). They don’t need it that much. Yes wheeler will decline but I don’t see scheifele declining until at least the end of this contract which is still 5 years away.

Imo, as you said the jest make the choice, and imo they get a potential 1c for the future, rather than fixing their 2c issue right now. And they land a future top 4 rd. Imo wheeler isn’t that crucial considering the jets will have off Roslovic or Vesalainen to replace him. I know they won’t be as good, but still they will be 60 pt wingers imo
MisstheWhalers a aimé ceci.
 
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