Forums/Armchair-GM

Domi but not for brodin

Créé par: Wqrrior
Date de création initiale: mai 19, 2020
Publié: May 19 at 3:10 am
Équipe: 2020-21 Wild du Minnesota
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
LISTE DE RÉSERVEANNÉESCAP HIT
Kaprizov, Kirill2925 000 $
Johansson, Filip3925 000 $
RFAANNÉESCAP HIT
Domi, Max45 275 000 $
Kunin, Luke32 875 000 $
Kähkönen, Kaapo2875 000 $
Belpedio, Louis2725 000 $
Menell, Brennan2725 000 $
Sturm, Nico2875 000 $
UFAANNÉESCAP HIT
Koivu, Mikko11 000 000 $
Greiss, Thomas13 750 000 $
Transactions
MIN
  1. Domi, Max [Droits de RFA]
MTL
  1. Greenway, Jordan [Droits de RFA]
  2. Stalock, Alex
  3. 2021 2e round pick (MIN)
Détails additionnels:
(about the total value of a first, second and third)

If Domi scores more than 54 points in 2021 OR 2022, then MIN also sends (any) 2022 2nd
MIN
  1. Vesalainen, Kristian
  2. Poolman, Tucker
  3. 2021 1e round pick (WPG)
  4. 2022 3e round pick (WPG)
WPG
  1. Dumba, Matt
MIN
  1. Mahura, Josh
ANA
  1. Donato, Ryan
MIN
  1. 2022 2e round pick (PIT)
PIT
  1. Hunt, Brad
  2. 2022 4e round pick (MIN)
MIN
  1. Howden, Brett
  2. 2021 2e round pick (NYR)
Détails additionnels:
trade deadline (assumes a mediocre year for howden)
NYR
  1. Staal, Eric (1 250 000 $ retained)
Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
  • Eric Staal: 1 250 000 $ (38,46%)
ANNÉE DE REPÊCHAGERONDE 1RONDE 2RONDE 3RONDE 4RONDE 5RONDE 6RONDE 7
2020
MIN
PIT
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
2021
MIN
WPG
NYR
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
MIN
2022
MIN
MIN
PIT
MIN
WPG
MIN
MIN
MIN
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS BONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2581 500 000 $74 216 922 $0 $982 500 $7 283 078 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
MIN
Parise, Zach
7 538 461 $
AG
NMC
UFA - 5
Domi, Max
5 275 000 $
C, AG
RFA
MIN
Fiala, Kevin
3 000 000 $
AG
RFA - 1
MIN
Kaprizov, Kirill
925 000 $
AG, AD
RFA
NYR
Howden, Brett
863 333 $
C
RFA - 1
MIN
Zuccarello, Mats
6 000 000 $
AD
NMC
UFA - 4
WPG
Vesalainen, Kristian
894 167 $
AG, AD
RFA - 2
MIN
Eriksson Ek, Joel
1 487 500 $
C
RFA - 1
MIN
Kunin, Luke
2 875 000 $
AD, C
RFA
MIN
Foligno, Marcus
2 875 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 1
MIN
Koivu, Mikko
1 000 000 $
C
UFA
MIN
Hartman, Ryan
1 900 000 $
AG, AD
RFA - 1
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
MIN
Suter, Ryan
7 538 461 $
DG
NMC
UFA - 5
MIN
Spurgeon, Jared
7 575 000 $
DD
NMC
UFA - 7
Greiss, Thomas
3 750 000 $
G
UFA
MIN
Brodin, Jonas
4 166 667 $
DG
UFA - 1
WPG
Poolman, Tucker
775 000 $
DD
UFA - 1
MIN
Kähkönen, Kaapo
875 000 $
G
RFA
ANA
Mahura, Josh
745 000 $
DG
RFA - 1
MIN
Pateryn, Greg
2 250 000 $
DD
UFA - 1
MIN
Dubnyk, Devan
4 333 333 $
G
NTC
UFA - 1
MIN
Menell, Brennan
725 000 $
D
RFA
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
MIN
Rask, Victor
4 000 000 $
C
UFA - 2
MIN
Belpedio, Louis
725 000 $
DD
RFA
MIN
Sturm, Nico
875 000 $
C
RFA

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19 mai à 3 h 31
#1
Lafreniere to NYR
Rejoint: oct 2018
Messages: 4,622
Mentions "j'aime": 986
Eric Staal can stay away, Thanks.
19 mai à 3 h 37
#2
Rejoint: mai 2016
Messages: 4,287
Mentions "j'aime": 1,122
MTL would just be better off keeping Domi and playing him at wing over Greenway. Stalock really doesn't do anything for them either.

Hunt is only worth a 4th or 5th. Trading him + 4th might get you a mid 3rd round pick.

I don't think NYR is the team that will want a Staal rental at the TDL next year. I also don't think MN will be sellers at the TDL next year. Sitting on the fence or slight buyers (rental goalie or rental bottom-6 C).

I don't see the Jets paying a premium for Dumba.
HabsForEver a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 4 h 44
#3
Rejoint: jui 2019
Messages: 5,634
Mentions "j'aime": 1,679
And Lindgren + Byron vs Kirill Kaprizov
Deal
19 mai à 8 h 27
#4
Rejoint: jan 2020
Messages: 297
Mentions "j'aime": 96
That’s not a good return for Domi....Greenwood has shown no signs of being a top 6 winger, Stalock may be a good option but something of way more value would need to be included.

Domi is reaching his prime and Dumba May start declining yet the return for Dumba you’re suggesting is way better. Easy no from habs,
19 mai à 8 h 27
#5
Rejoint: mar 2019
Messages: 1,693
Mentions "j'aime": 1,262
Quoting: GMs
And Lindgren + Byron vs Kirill Kaprizov
Deal


lol is Guerin's actual response to that proposal.
mnwild1790 et Paul13 a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 8 h 40
#6
Rejoint: nov 2017
Messages: 9,577
Mentions "j'aime": 3,736
That is a very underwhelming offer for Domi.
GMs a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 9 h 12
#7
Rejoint: mai 2015
Messages: 17,252
Mentions "j'aime": 4,702
Unless at least one top prospect or one 1st round pick is involved, no package of essentially futures is going to move the needle. Habs are not trying to move this guy at all costs or anything. This isn't a mike Hoffman in Ottawa situation.
GMs a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 9 h 21
#8
Rejoint: mai 2017
Messages: 4,690
Mentions "j'aime": 945
Swap Greenway for Beckman or Boldy and your offer gets in the ballpark.
19 mai à 10 h 58
#9
Rejoint: déc 2019
Messages: 593
Mentions "j'aime": 458
Quoting: JayTea
lol is Guerin's actual response to that proposal.


Quoting: GMs
And Lindgren + Byron vs Kirill Kaprizov
Deal


There would be a riot in Minnesota if Kaprizov gets traded. He's already a star here
JayTea, Wqrrior et Paul13 a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 16 h 11
#10
Rejoint: jui 2019
Messages: 5,634
Mentions "j'aime": 1,679
Quoting: JayTea
lol is Guerin's actual response to that proposal.


Quoting: mnwild1790
There would be a riot in Minnesota if Kaprizov gets traded. He's already a star here


This offer for Domi is really bad, so I did one bad to even it out
mnwild1790 a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 16 h 19
#11
Rejoint: mar 2019
Messages: 1,693
Mentions "j'aime": 1,262
Quoting: GMs
This offer for Domi is really bad, so I did one bad to even it out


Not even close.

Domi is a 44 point forward with 1 70 point season that the OP is offering a young forward, a cheap backup goalie, and a 2nd for. You offered a cap dump and a prospect for the best prospect out of the NHL.
Wqrrior et Paul13 a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 16 h 28
#12
Rejoint: jui 2019
Messages: 5,634
Mentions "j'aime": 1,679
Quoting: JayTea
Not even close.

Domi is a 44 point forward with 1 70 point season that the OP is offering a young forward, a cheap backup goalie, and a 2nd for. You offered a cap dump and a prospect for the best prospect out of the NHL.


Domi only did one 40 points season in Arizona, he’s a 50+ points forward
19 mai à 16 h 33
#13
Rejoint: mar 2019
Messages: 1,693
Mentions "j'aime": 1,262
Quoting: GMs
Domi only did one 40 points season in Arizona, he’s a 50+ points forward


Are we talking about the same Max Domi?

15/16 52
16/17 38
17/18 45
18/19 72
19/20 44

Habs fans... lol
Wqrrior a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 16 h 40
#14
Démarrer sujet
Wqrrior
Rejoint: fév 2019
Messages: 5,394
Mentions "j'aime": 1,353
Quoting: JayTea
Are we talking about the same Max Domi?

15/16 52
16/17 38
17/18 45
18/19 72
19/20 44

Habs fans... lol


The only part about Domi in their assessment that I agree with is that they don't NEED to move him. However, I would have to say his value has peaked and will be on the decline, so I make these trades actually for their benefit. Domi is a 2nd liner at best... a 40 -50 point support guy... he isn't carrying a line.

His value should be around the same as what VGK traded Tatar for... a first, second and third. Greenway holds the value of a first, Stalock a 3rd (and fills a desperate need for MTL), and potentially a pair of 2nds if he lives up to the supposed value he carries.

It's funny how if a mediocre to average player spends any time with the Habs their value suddenly skyrockets. If MTL was BUYING Domi from any other team, I bet they'd be doing it for a pair of 2nds and that's all.
JayTea a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 16 h 45
#15
Rejoint: mar 2019
Messages: 1,693
Mentions "j'aime": 1,262
Quoting: Wqrrior
The only part about Domi in their assessment that I agree with is that they don't NEED to move him. However, I would have to say his value has peaked and will be on the decline, so I make these trades actually for their benefit. Domi is a 2nd liner at best... a 40 -50 point support guy... he isn't carrying a line.

His value should be around the same as what VGK traded Tatar for... a first, second and third. Greenway holds the value of a first, Stalock a 3rd (and fills a desperate need for MTL), and potentially a pair of 2nds if he lives up to the supposed value he carries.

It's funny how if a mediocre to average player spends any time with the Habs their value suddenly skyrockets. If MTL was BUYING Domi from any other team, I bet they'd be doing it for a pair of 2nds and that's all.


Oh I agree they might not even want to move him. They have Suzuki coming up, but how ready is he? Can they keep Danaul when his deal is up? Does keeping Domi and moving him to the wing make more sense since so many Habs fans have pointed out he doesn't have anyone to play with? Keeping him might make the most sense, but this insane value they think he carries is getting to be a bit much.
Wqrrior a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 17 h 09
#16
Rejoint: jui 2019
Messages: 5,634
Mentions "j'aime": 1,679
Quoting: JayTea
Are we talking about the same Max Domi?

15/16 52
16/17 38
17/18 45
18/19 72
19/20 44

Habs fans... lol


That’s all on 82 games right ...
19 mai à 17 h 09
#17
Rejoint: jan 2018
Messages: 373
Mentions "j'aime": 145
Modifié 19 mai à 19 h 15
Quoting: Wqrrior
The only part about Domi in their assessment that I agree with is that they don't NEED to move him. However, I would have to say his value has peaked and will be on the decline, so I make these trades actually for their benefit. Domi is a 2nd liner at best... a 40 -50 point support guy... he isn't carrying a line.

His value should be around the same as what VGK traded Tatar for... a first, second and third. Greenway holds the value of a first, Stalock a 3rd (and fills a desperate need for MTL), and potentially a pair of 2nds if he lives up to the supposed value he carries.

It's funny how if a mediocre to average player spends any time with the Habs their value suddenly skyrockets. If MTL was BUYING Domi from any other team, I bet they'd be doing it for a pair of 2nds and that's all.


Glass houses man, you talk about MTL fans overvaluing players while saying Greenway, a 23 year old bottom 6 winger, is worth a 1st. And Stalock doesn't really do much, at least until part way into the season considering Primeau and the signing of Demchenko.
Also, Domi has, based on points per game, been on pace for 50 every season but 1, so saying 40-50 point guy comes off as an undersell, even if it's accurate do him having some injury issues. I mean he was on pace for 50 this season and even non MTL fans are saying it was a down season, not just a regression but a down season. Domi is better, younger, and an RFA when compared to Tatar at the time of the Vegas trade, so he would be worth more.
A comparison would be Lehkonen, Juulsen and a 2nd for Brodin, Wild fans would be rightly insulted.
GMs a aimé ceci.
19 mai à 17 h 15
#18
Rejoint: jui 2019
Messages: 5,634
Mentions "j'aime": 1,679
Quoting: Wqrrior
The only part about Domi in their assessment that I agree with is that they don't NEED to move him. However, I would have to say his value has peaked and will be on the decline, so I make these trades actually for their benefit. Domi is a 2nd liner at best... a 40 -50 point support guy... he isn't carrying a line.

His value should be around the same as what VGK traded Tatar for... a first, second and third. Greenway holds the value of a first, Stalock a 3rd (and fills a desperate need for MTL), and potentially a pair of 2nds if he lives up to the supposed value he carries.

It's funny how if a mediocre to average player spends any time with the Habs their value suddenly skyrockets. If MTL was BUYING Domi from any other team, I bet they'd be doing it for a pair of 2nds and that's all.


Quoting: JayTea
Oh I agree they might not even want to move him. They have Suzuki coming up, but how ready is he? Can they keep Danaul when his deal is up? Does keeping Domi and moving him to the wing make more sense since so many Habs fans have pointed out he doesn't have anyone to play with? Keeping him might make the most sense, but this insane value they think he carries is getting to be a bit much.


You guys are stupid. Tatar-Danault-Gallagher are un breakable, Suzuki is the 2C and Domi DOESN’T want to play winger. So that leaves Domi centering the 3rd line, but we have Kotkaniemi and Poehling who can play 3C. If Domi really want to play center, we could move Suzuki on the RW, but Suzuki is a better center than Domi is. And YES, Domi was carrying is line when he did 72 points with Drouin/Lehkonen and Shaw. This year Cousins and Weal were just no good enough Drouin/Lehkonen/Shaw >> Cousins Weal. We won’t trade Domi for spare parts, Greenway is useless, we already have Tatar Drouin Lehkonen Byron playing LW. We can sign a backup goalie this summer better than Stalock, so this trade is just bad. Domi is good AF, it’s just annoying he wants to play center instead of winger.
19 mai à 17 h 28
#19
Rejoint: mar 2019
Messages: 1,693
Mentions "j'aime": 1,262
Quoting: GMs
That’s all on 82 games right ...


Weird, I missed where the league adjusts point totals for guys playing less than 82 games.
19 mai à 17 h 55
#20
Rejoint: mar 2019
Messages: 1,693
Mentions "j'aime": 1,262
Quoting: GMs
You guys are stupid. Tatar-Danault-Gallagher are un breakable, Suzuki is the 2C and Domi DOESN’T want to play winger. So that leaves Domi centering the 3rd line, but we have Kotkaniemi and Poehling who can play 3C. If Domi really want to play center, we could move Suzuki on the RW, but Suzuki is a better center than Domi is. And YES, Domi was carrying is line when he did 72 points with Drouin/Lehkonen and Shaw. This year Cousins and Weal were just no good enough Drouin/Lehkonen/Shaw >> Cousins Weal. We won’t trade Domi for spare parts, Greenway is useless, we already have Tatar Drouin Lehkonen Byron playing LW. We can sign a backup goalie this summer better than Stalock, so this trade is just bad. Domi is good AF, it’s just annoying he wants to play center instead of winger.


Well Greenway wouldn't be useless if you let the Habs trade for him, he'd get top 6 minutes and become a valuable 44 point forward just for wearing the Habs jersey.
19 mai à 19 h 15
#21
Rejoint: mai 2016
Messages: 4,287
Mentions "j'aime": 1,122
Quoting: Wqrrior
The only part about Domi in their assessment that I agree with is that they don't NEED to move him. However, I would have to say his value has peaked and will be on the decline, so I make these trades actually for their benefit. Domi is a 2nd liner at best... a 40 -50 point support guy... he isn't carrying a line.

His value should be around the same as what VGK traded Tatar for... a first, second and third. Greenway holds the value of a first, Stalock a 3rd (and fills a desperate need for MTL), and potentially a pair of 2nds if he lives up to the supposed value he carries.

It's funny how if a mediocre to average player spends any time with the Habs their value suddenly skyrockets. If MTL was BUYING Domi from any other team, I bet they'd be doing it for a pair of 2nds and that's all.


I like Greenway a lot, but he doesn't have the value of a 1st. He's trending to be a 3rd liner 150 games into his career. There is still time to turn into the power FWD Wild fans hope he becomes, but his stats are on par with Foligno his first 150 NHL games.
19 mai à 19 h 53
#22
Démarrer sujet
Wqrrior
Rejoint: fév 2019
Messages: 5,394
Mentions "j'aime": 1,353
Quoting: wabit
I like Greenway a lot, but he doesn't have the value of a 1st. He's trending to be a 3rd liner 150 games into his career. There is still time to turn into the power FWD Wild fans hope he becomes, but his stats are on par with Foligno his first 150 NHL games.


perhaps MTL would prefer Ek? I figured they'd want the gameplay style that Domi had, but I would have to agree than he seems like a third liner. My assessment might be a bit high, but I was also being generous in what I was giving to MTL, though I'm sure their fans would strongly disagree with that.
19 mai à 20 h 11
#23
Rejoint: jan 2018
Messages: 373
Mentions "j'aime": 145
Quoting: Wqrrior
perhaps MTL would prefer Ek? I figured they'd want the gameplay style that Domi had, but I would have to agree than he seems like a third liner. My assessment might be a bit high, but I was also being generous in what I was giving to MTL, though I'm sure their fans would strongly disagree with that.


You think a different 23 year old 3rd liner would change the value? A 2nd rounder, a backup goalie that as I already pointed out in my previous post isn't even likely something MTL is looking for in the offseason, and a 3rd liner isn't a generous offer for a 2C and whether you like it or not that's where Domi's stats put him. Again, the best comparison to your offer is Lehkonen, Juulsen and a 2nd for Brodin, and no Wild fan is taking that.
19 mai à 20 h 40
#24
Démarrer sujet
Wqrrior
Rejoint: fév 2019
Messages: 5,394
Mentions "j'aime": 1,353
Quoting: J2W
You think a different 23 year old 3rd liner would change the value? A 2nd rounder, a backup goalie that as I already pointed out in my previous post isn't even likely something MTL is looking for in the offseason, and a 3rd liner isn't a generous offer for a 2C and whether you like it or not that's where Domi's stats put him. Again, the best comparison to your offer is Lehkonen, Juulsen and a 2nd for Brodin, and no Wild fan is taking that.


Greenway/Ek > Lehkonen. Stalock > Juulsen. And Brodin > Domi. (Though I'll give you that Brodin as a UFA balances it) Of course they wouldn't take that. Lehkonen is also largely overvalued by habs fans. He's more of a bottom six player than either of those I offered.

There might be a difference between a 2nd line center and a third line center, but you are enlarging it to be far more drastic than it should be. Also I am trading for his rights here, not a set contract. He might demand so much money that MTL won't want to sign him and that they are forced to trade him for the sake of the team long term.
If he was already signed and there was more clarity on what his contract picture was like, a reasonable contract would warrant him a higher return.
19 mai à 20 h 57
#25
Rejoint: jan 2018
Messages: 373
Mentions "j'aime": 145
Quoting: Wqrrior
Greenway/Ek > Lehkonen. Stalock > Juulsen. And Brodin > Domi. (Though I'll give you that Brodin as a UFA balances it) Of course they wouldn't take that. Lehkonen is also largely overvalued by habs fans. He's more of a bottom six player than either of those I offered.

There might be a difference between a 2nd line center and a third line center, but you are enlarging it to be far more drastic than it should be. Also I am trading for his rights here, not a set contract. He might demand so much money that MTL won't want to sign him and that they are forced to trade him for the sake of the team long term.
If he was already signed and there was more clarity on what his contract picture was like, a reasonable contract would warrant him a higher return.


Lehkonen is also a 3rd line winger, of similar age to Greenway and Ek, and while less talented offensively is better defensively, pick what you value more in your bottom 6 and that's who has more value. Personally I would go Ek-Lehkonen-Greenway, but to each their own. Backups have less value than they should, simply because some prospect could jump out of nowhere and make the trade a waste of value, and while Juulsen does have low value do to injury with Primeau and the Demchenko signing it's doubtful MTL views him as less valuable than a backup during the offseason.
Brodin would be a rental who could leave for nothing if his ask is to high or just if he feels like it, while even Domi's rights give you value because he is an RFA, so Domi has more value than Brodin without an extension.
Seriously though, you're overvaluing Wild players, while trying to be on a high horse about Habs fans overvaluing Habs players. Look at past deals for young 50 point RFA centers, they don't come this cheap. Rentals cost more.
GMs a aimé ceci.
 
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