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habs trade

Créé par: MTLaveragefan
Équipe: 2020-21 Lightning de Tampa Bay
Date de création initiale: 9 mai 2020
Publié: 9 mai 2020
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
There is one more guy to dump

habs could take another cap dump if the price is right - send us your Québecois
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
RFAANSCAP HIT
12 000 000 $
24 000 000 $
Transactions
TBL
  1. Hillis, Cameron [Liste de réserve]
  2. Petry, Jeff (2 000 000 $ retained)
  3. Ylönen, Jesse
  4. Choix de 2e ronde en 2020 (CHI)
Détails additionnels:
gives Tampa some flexibility with the flat cap.

gives tampa a great RHD to compete another year while we wait for things to return to normal
MTL
  1. Gourde, Yanni
  2. Sergachev, Mikhail [Droits de RFA]
Détails additionnels:
habs get another Russian LHD, and a Quebecois would need to see greener pastures.
Rachats de contrats
Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
2020
Logo de TBL
Logo de CHI
Logo de TBL
Logo de PHI
Logo de TBL
Logo de DET
Logo de TBL
Logo de OTT
Logo de TBL
2021
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de NSH
Logo de NJD
2022
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
Logo de TBL
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2081 500 000 $83 017 591 $0 $500 000 $-1 517 591 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
5 000 000 $5 000 000 $
AD, C, AG
NTC
UFA - 4
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
6 750 000 $6 750 000 $
C, AD
UFA - 2
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
AD
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
8 500 000 $8 500 000 $
AG, C
NMC
UFA - 4
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
4 000 000 $4 000 000 $
C, AG
UFA - 3
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
833 333 $833 333 $
AD
RFA - 1
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
4 450 000 $4 450 000 $
AD, AG
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
759 258 $759 258 $
AD, AG
UFA - 1
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
5 300 000 $5 300 000 $
AG, AD
NTC
UFA - 2
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
1 800 000 $1 800 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 1
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
1 650 000 $1 650 000 $
C, AG, AD
UFA - 1
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
925 000 $925 000 $
C, AG
UFA - 1
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
7 875 000 $7 875 000 $
DG
NMC
UFA - 5
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
3 500 000 $3 500 000 $
DD
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 1
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
G
UFA - 8
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
6 750 000 $6 750 000 $
DG
NTC
UFA - 6
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
2 000 000 $2 000 000 $
DD
UFA - 3
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
1 300 000 $1 300 000 $
G
UFA - 1
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
1 700 000 $1 700 000 $
DG
NTC
UFA - 1
Logo de Lightning de Tampa Bay
925 000 $925 000 $ (Bonis de performance500 000 $$500K)
DD
RFA - 1

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9 mai 2020 à 14 h 57
#1
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bolts decline
9 mai 2020 à 14 h 58
#2
Evans truther
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Yeah that's a no. Not because he's from Quebec that I want his bad contract.

Sergachev's worth a 1st, 2nd and 3rd with an offersheet so I won't give a half retained Petry, top six prospect (Ylonen), middle six prospect (Hillis) and an early 2nd for him.
Even with all this cap crunch you're still over the top with 3 more players to sign ... Boy that offseason's going to be a fun one to watch.
9 mai 2020 à 15 h 14
#3
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Quoting: ColonelX
Yeah that's a no. Not because he's from Quebec that I want his bad contract.

Sergachev's worth a 1st, 2nd and 3rd with an offersheet so I won't give a half retained Petry, top six prospect (Ylonen), middle six prospect (Hillis) and an early 2nd for him.
Even with all this cap crunch you're still over the top with 3 more players to sign ... Boy that offseason's going to be a fun one to watch.


Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
bolts decline



lol, well if my trades gets both reaction, it tells me I'm not far.
9 mai 2020 à 15 h 17
#4
tml
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
bolts decline


Why would tampa decline? HUGE over pay by MTL. Gourde has negative value with that contract (and sub par performance) and Sergachev is worth a 1st and 3rd max.
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9 mai 2020 à 15 h 28
#5
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Quoting: Silverbug
Why would tampa decline? HUGE over pay by MTL. Gourde has negative value with that contract (and sub par performance) and Sergachev is worth a 1st and 3rd max.


Sergachev >> Ylonen and 1 year of Petry.
Gourde does not have negative value lol, 1 bad year doesnt make him not a good middle 6 50 point player
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9 mai 2020 à 15 h 36
#6
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
Sergachev >> Ylonen and 1 year of Petry.
Gourde does not have negative value lol, 1 bad year doesnt make him not a good middle 6 50 point player


When you dont have cap space you dont get true value. The best you can hope for is Sergachev signs an OS. The longer things go the worse it gets for TBL. Cap space and actual $ will be the deciding factor on a lot of trades this coming off season. Actual hockey trades will be rare.... Also most trades will involve equal caps being traded.
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9 mai 2020 à 16 h 3
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
Sergachev >> Ylonen and 1 year of Petry.
Gourde does not have negative value lol, 1 bad year doesnt make him not a good middle 6 50 point player


yeah obviously ! if he was under contract! or in a position to sign him without sacrificing Cirelli, Cernak... and yet having to sign 4 more players with absolutely no cap space to do so.

but you have to face the fact that many guys might leave this summer... or have a seriously depleted lineup. Gourde has an NTC... but he might be willing to waive to play for the sainte-flanelle... (remember how the habs are important in Québec)
9 mai 2020 à 16 h 12
#8
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Quoting: MTLaveragefan
yeah obviously ! if he was under contract! or in a position to sign him without sacrificing Cirelli, Cernak... and yet having to sign 4 more players with absolutely no cap space to do so.

but you have to face the fact that many guys might leave this summer... or have a seriously depleted lineup. Gourde has an NTC... but he might be willing to waive to play for the sainte-flanelle... (remember how the habs are important in Québec)


he could waive yes, but the cost to move him wont be Sergachev
9 mai 2020 à 16 h 17
#9
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
he could waive yes, but the cost to move him wont be Sergachev


but now you move him and get better value out of sergatchev than a first, a second and third from an O.S.
9 mai 2020 à 16 h 19
#10
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Quoting: MTLaveragefan
but now you move him and get better value out of sergatchev than a first, a second and third from an O.S.


Sergachev actually has to sign an offer sheet, does he want to? Unlikely, Point and Marner received offer sheets last year and refused to look at them. People dont like change.
9 mai 2020 à 16 h 21
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
Sergachev actually has to sign an offer sheet, does he want to? Unlikely, Point and Marner received offer sheets last year and refused to look at them.


because their respective team had the money to offer them. If the best offer he can get from the TBL is 3M x2... he might prefer to get 6.5x5 and not be behind Hedman or Mcdo for a while.
9 mai 2020 à 17 h 9
#12
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Serg won't be traded or accept an OS. Neither Serg nor Cirelli are interested in leaving a top contender. Tampa will either bridge them both between 4 and 5, or bridge one and sign the other long term. Sure, maybe they have to trade Cernak in the latter scenario, but Serg and Cirelli are far more important to the future. Tampa won't be having to attach huge sweeteners to Gourde or Johnson either, if one waives, as neither has negative value. If there's a cbo, Tampa is more than fine in keeping all 3 main rfas and even if there's not, getting a player to waive is far from impossible. Tampa will likely roll a 21 or 22 player roster to start and the main losses will be Killorn, likely Gourde(but possibly Johnson),.Paquette and possibly Coburn. These players already have good replacements in the lineup thanks to the Coleman and Goodrow deals plus the multiple number of young guys ready for a middle to bottom 6 role here or in Syracuse(Stephens, Verhaeghe, Volkov, Barre-Boulet, Joseph etc). Worst case they trade Cernak if the $ simply isn't there but neither Serg nor Cirelli are wearing another team's sweater next season.
9 mai 2020 à 17 h 27
#13
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Quoting: JTBF81
Serg won't be traded or accept an OS. Neither Serg nor Cirelli are interested in leaving a top contender. Tampa will either bridge them both between 4 and 5, or bridge one and sign the other long term. Sure, maybe they have to trade Cernak in the latter scenario, but Serg and Cirelli are far more important to the future. Tampa won't be having to attach huge sweeteners to Gourde or Johnson either, if one waives, as neither has negative value. If there's a cbo, Tampa is more than fine in keeping all 3 main rfas and even if there's not, getting a player to waive is far from impossible. Tampa will likely roll a 21 or 22 player roster to start and the main losses will be Killorn, likely Gourde(but possibly Johnson),.Paquette and possibly Coburn. These players already have good replacements in the lineup thanks to the Coleman and Goodrow deals plus the multiple number of young guys ready for a middle to bottom 6 role here or in Syracuse(Stephens, Verhaeghe, Volkov, Barre-Boulet, Joseph etc). Worst case they trade Cernak if the $ simply isn't there but neither Serg nor Cirelli are wearing another team's sweater next season.


there won't be a CBO bud, and even if you bridge... you will still be in deep cap trouble because starting your off-season... you have 8 roster spot to fill... with 6M. and those Syracuse players aren't free Stephens, Verhaeghe, Volkov, Barre-Boulet, Joseph ... that's at least 4.5M right there, leaving you with 1.7M to sign Serg, Cernak or Cirelli.

because for the same reasons you think Serg, Cernak or Cirelli won't sign an OS or be traded, your "Cap dumps" won't waive their NTC or NMC. why would they? you live in tampa, with lower tax, on a competitive team. And another question... WHY would a team want to help Tampa? they have no reason to. Like vultures they will come and pick at the bones. Tampa has got no leverage... it's that or an O.S they can't match... and if they do... then another will come along.
9 mai 2020 à 17 h 49
#14
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Quoting: Silverbug
Why would tampa decline? HUGE over pay by MTL. Gourde has negative value with that contract (and sub par performance) and Sergachev is worth a 1st and 3rd max.


Huge overpay by the Habs, Dude it's garbage. Why would Tampa have any interest in Jeff Petry for 1 yr at $3.5 mil? A guy that's not even signed yet a 2nd and Ylonen for Sergachev abd Gourde. If you call that overpay, It's garbage overpay.
9 mai 2020 à 18 h 16
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Quoting: DiehardRedWingsFan58
Huge overpay by the Habs, Dude it's garbage. Why would Tampa have any interest in Jeff Petry for 1 yr at $3.5 mil? A guy that's not even signed yet a 2nd and Ylonen for Sergachev abd Gourde. If you call that overpay, It's garbage overpay.


It gives them a top pairing RHDman for next season, for cheap (2M retained). (40 +pts), a high 2nd round pick and good prospect in Ylonen and a 1.5ppg OHL player in Hillis. for a Dman they will lose, and a cap dump.
It buys Tampa time, and gives them the opportunity to compete another year... Or we go the OS route and Tampa can suck on a mid-first round pick in 2021, a second, and a third. And still have holes at D.
9 mai 2020 à 19 h 33
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Quoting: DiehardRedWingsFan58
Huge overpay by the Habs, Dude it's garbage. Why would Tampa have any interest in Jeff Petry for 1 yr at $3.5 mil? A guy that's not even signed yet a 2nd and Ylonen for Sergachev abd Gourde. If you call that overpay, It's garbage overpay.


Quoting: MTLaveragefan
It gives them a top pairing RHDman for next season, for cheap (2M retained). (40 +pts), a high 2nd round pick and good prospect in Ylonen and a 1.5ppg OHL player in Hillis. for a Dman they will lose, and a cap dump.
It buys Tampa time, and gives them the opportunity to compete another year... Or we go the OS route and Tampa can suck on a mid-first round pick in 2021, a second, and a third. And still have holes at D.

Both of you need to get closer to the middle. The offer isn't "garbage" but I wouldn't call Gourde a "dump" either, maybe a cap relief could be a better choice of words? Let's split this deal into pieces, shall we.
-Tampa getting a top pairing defenseman for one year at under 4M$ is a ridiculously good thing.
-Ylönen quietly had an excellent season with a mediocre team in Liiga (Played with the equivalence of fourth liners all year) and Hillis is made in the same mold as Suzuki (This kid's legit the biggest sleeper in our prospect pool), I wouldn't like to trade either of those away.
-High seconds can fetch you guys like Debrincat, Romanov or Aho so don't underestimate the pick.
-Sergachev's value is all over the place on this website, some think they can get McDavid and other offers scrubs for him and 25M$ dumps. Personally I wouldn't offer more (Or something slightly over) his offersheet value, something like a 1st with prospects or whatever.
- Gourde's offense has been on a downward trend for two straight years now, is it worrying? Yes it should be, especially with 6 years left at 5.2M$ (With a no trade clause on top of it). A bottom six winger shouldn't be your fifth cap hit forward if he isn't producing like he did a couple years back so get your head out of your a**, yes he's got some negative value especially with the cap taking a hit this year.
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9 mai 2020 à 19 h 59
#17
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Quoting: ColonelX
Both of you need to get closer to the middle. The offer isn't "garbage" but I wouldn't call Gourde a "dump" either, maybe a cap relief could be a better choice of words? Let's split this deal into pieces, shall we.
-Tampa getting a top pairing defenseman for one year at under 4M$ is a ridiculously good thing.
-Ylönen quietly had an excellent season with a mediocre team in Liiga (Played with the equivalence of fourth liners all year) and Hillis is made in the same mold as Suzuki (This kid's legit the biggest sleeper in our prospect pool), I wouldn't like to trade either of those away.
-High seconds can fetch you guys like Debrincat, Romanov or Aho so don't underestimate the pick.
-Sergachev's value is all over the place on this website, some think they can get McDavid and other offers scrubs for him and 25M$ dumps. Personally I wouldn't offer more (Or something slightly over) his offersheet value, something like a 1st with prospects or whatever.
- Gourde's offense has been on a downward trend for two straight years now, is it worrying? Yes it should be, especially with 6 years left at 5.2M$ (With a no trade clause on top of it). A bottom six winger shouldn't be your fifth cap hit forward if he isn't producing like he did a couple years back so get your head out of your a**, yes he's got some negative value especially with the cap taking a hit this year.


true, cap relief is a better word in this case.
9 mai 2020 à 23 h 26
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Quoting: MTLaveragefan
there won't be a CBO bud, and even if you bridge... you will still be in deep cap trouble because starting your off-season... you have 8 roster spot to fill... with 6M. and those Syracuse players aren't free Stephens, Verhaeghe, Volkov, Barre-Boulet, Joseph ... that's at least 4.5M right there, leaving you with 1.7M to sign Serg, Cernak or Cirelli.

because for the same reasons you think Serg, Cernak or Cirelli won't sign an OS or be traded, your "Cap dumps" won't waive their NTC or NMC. why would they? you live in tampa, with lower tax, on a competitive team. And another question... WHY would a team want to help Tampa? they have no reason to. Like vultures they will come and pick at the bones. Tampa has got no leverage... it's that or an O.S they can't match... and if they do... then another will come along.


Myself and several real Tampa fans have already posted several lineups that work where they keep all 3. Those of us that really know Tampa and how they get things done have heard the same thing for several years and at this point it means little. Glad though that you just know there won't be a cbo and that Tampa supposedly has no leverage and will just have to trade players for scraps or lose them. We've heard about losing Point last year, Stamkos when he was surely gone for $ as a UFA and with trading Miller last year. Tampa will more than likely keep the rfa's since staying with Tampa for a little less $ is favorable to playing for a weak team with higher taxes. Tampa has also convinced players to waive NTC's before, not saying it's easy, but still more likely than Brisebois trading one of Serg or Cirelli.

Tampa doesn't have "cap dumps" as neither Johnson nor Gourde have terrible contracts and thus don't require additions to move. Even with the drop in production this year mainly due to loss of ice time and playing on a line with rookies or on a more defensive checking line, Gourde still has averaged almost .6 ppg for his career and is an asset defensively. He may be slightly overpaid but not by much if anything. Johnson st 5 million is also not a cap dump, a player that averages over .6 ppg and had 29 goals last year is far from some throw away trade piece. He can still play C as well and there are teams that will be interested if he becomes available. You and so many others can continue to push your narrative that as all the GMs ofvthe league as re out to get to Tampa and that any notion of cbo/cap relief/ntc waiving is impossible, but again those of us that really know and follow Tampa will stick with many examples of how Tsmpa keeps things moving and doesn't ever seem to lose their key rfa's. Guess we'll see how this off season turns out.
9 mai 2020 à 23 h 44
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Here is just one possible and definitely realistic lineup for opening night next year:
Stamkos-Point-Kucherov(24.75)
Coleman-Cirelli-Palat(11.35)
Johnson/Gourde-Stephens-ABB/Volkov/Joseph(6.7-6.9)
Maroon-Verhaeghe-Goodrow(2.8)
700-800k for a 13th F
46.3-46.6
Hedman-Rutta(9.275)
McD-Cernak(9.25)
Sergachev-Foote(5.675)
Schenn/Gaunce/Masin as 7/8 options
24.9
Vasi(9.5)
McE(1.3)
10.8
These numbers come out to 82 to 82.3 million, so yes they are around 500 to 800k over a flat cap at 22 players, but with some fine tuning of certain contract #'s, Tampa still can definitely ice a strong 21 or 22 player roster. I have little doubt JBB and his team can figure this out.
A lineup something similar to this is very realistic, with some changes depending on whether JBB and Maroon are both interested in having him come back, whether they want Bogosian in the top 6(Rutta seems like the better choice but who knows) and whether Cernak does have to get traded, in which case Serg moves back to the right side and Tampa figures out the best pair with McD. In any case, trading Serg and/or Cirelli are not going to happen.
10 mai 2020 à 0 h 0
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Quoting: MTLaveragefan
It gives them a top pairing RHDman for next season, for cheap (2M retained). (40 +pts), a high 2nd round pick and good prospect in Ylonen and a 1.5ppg OHL player in Hillis. for a Dman they will lose, and a cap dump.
It buys Tampa time, and gives them the opportunity to compete another year... Or we go the OS route and Tampa can suck on a mid-first round pick in 2021, a second, and a third. And still have holes at D.


Since Tampa won't be losing Serg back to Montreal or anyone else it doesn't matter, but yeah Tampa would easily decline this trade. Tampa doesn't need time, their prime cup window is now. They trade Sergachev for a lottery ticket pick, 2 prospects that won't be of great help for a couple years at best, and a dman they would be guaranteed to lose after 1 year. What a steal for Tampa...Even making a poor assumption that Sergachev would even accept an OS, Tampa would match in the 7 range and be willing to lose Cernak if necessary. Tampa won't be having holes in their defense, but nice try.
10 mai 2020 à 13 h 19
#21
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Quoting: JTBF81
Myself and several real Tampa fans have already posted several lineups that work where they keep all 3. Those of us that really know Tampa and how they get things done have heard the same thing for several years and at this point it means little. Glad though that you just know there won't be a cbo and that Tampa supposedly has no leverage and will just have to trade players for scraps or lose them. We've heard about losing Point last year, Stamkos when he was surely gone for $ as a UFA and with trading Miller last year. Tampa will more than likely keep the rfa's since staying with Tampa for a little less $ is favorable to playing for a weak team with higher taxes. Tampa has also convinced players to waive NTC's before, not saying it's easy, but still more likely than Brisebois trading one of Serg or Cirelli.

Tampa doesn't have "cap dumps" as neither Johnson nor Gourde have terrible contracts and thus don't require additions to move. Even with the drop in production this year mainly due to loss of ice time and playing on a line with rookies or on a more defensive checking line, Gourde still has averaged almost .6 ppg for his career and is an asset defensively. He may be slightly overpaid but not by much if anything. Johnson st 5 million is also not a cap dump, a player that averages over .6 ppg and had 29 goals last year is far from some throw away trade piece. He can still play C as well and there are teams that will be interested if he becomes available. You and so many others can continue to push your narrative that as all the GMs ofvthe league as re out to get to Tampa and that any notion of cbo/cap relief/ntc waiving is impossible, but again those of us that really know and follow Tampa will stick with many examples of how Tsmpa keeps things moving and doesn't ever seem to lose their key rfa's. Guess we'll see how this off season turns out.


It will be an exciting one for sure!!! and if Brisebois manages to keep all 3, I'll build him a church ahhaha. You are right, like another commenter mentioned, cap dump is not the right word. These players do have some value on its own. and I admit my knowledge of some of the players might be lacking (I didn't consider defensive abilities of a player in my value evaluation).

I guess, it will all depend on your RFA's willingness to take less money and your NTC and NMC to waive.
10 mai 2020 à 17 h 46
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As much as I would love to have a Romanov-Sergachev top 4, the ship has sailed. Just like how Sharks and Sens couldn't get back their top respective lottery pick or Bolts losing JT Miller to the Canucks for basically Blake Coleman. Although the only way it happens is if neither Gourde, Killorn, Palat or Johnson waive their NTC because Cirelli is more valuable than Sergachev.

I don't think Montreal also would give up either their 2020 top 10 pick or their 2021 1st round pick (what happens if they get stuck in the same scenario as the 19-20 Sharks or 18-19 Sens??) through an offersheet. There's no guarantee the Habs would make the playoffs in 2020-21
10 mai 2020 à 18 h 14
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Quoting: MTLaveragefan
It will be an exciting one for sure!!! and if Brisebois manages to keep all 3, I'll build him a church ahhaha. You are right, like another commenter mentioned, cap dump is not the right word. These players do have some value on its own. and I admit my knowledge of some of the players might be lacking (I didn't consider defensive abilities of a player in my value evaluation).

I guess, it will all depend on your RFA's willingness to take less money and your NTC and NMC to waive.

Thanks for the discussion, I don't think your prospects or players in the proposed trade are bad and they certainly have value, but for where Tampa currently is, it doesn't fit for them imo. Apologies for any harsh criticism of it earlier. While I believe Tamps can keep their 3 main rfa's, I certainly think Cernak may have to get moved, and if that's the price to be paid in order to keep Serg and Cirelli, then I believe most Tampa fans could accept that. Hopefully Brisebois will find a way to keep all 3, as there are a few ways it could occur, but anything is possible.
MTLaveragefan a aimé ceci.
 
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