I think he's been a pretty good GM but man, that ROR trade was bad. Although the Miller trade and MoJo signing was nice.

He's been great, I'd love to have him back in PIT, he's made one bad move, and even that was justifiable, although, i'm quite happy with the Montour trade from ANA'a perspective as well

crosby is pretty hot put him in here

The funny thing about the ROR trade is that it looked absolutely brilliant when St. Louis was in last place and Tage Thompson had a hot start to the season during that 10 game streak

I am not a botterill fan, but there is some truth here. If mittelstadt looks like the kind of player you expect to get at pick 8, its going to look a lot better. Other than that, he has brought in some players that are better than the guys they replaced, still not sure if they are actually good (miller, montour, jokiharju). Rochester is clearly a priority now, although getting swept in the first round in back to back years is a bit troubling. Meh, lets see how the year goes, if we end up around 90 points, he should be fine. 90 points still misses the playoffs. Thats a reasonable ask, make some progress.

Botterill has made some great moves, sure. He is also entering his 3rd season behind the helm; in a league where it has been proven it only takes 1-2 years to turn around a franchise.

How can you preach patience? His teams have finished 26th, 30th, 27th. The team hasn't made the playoffs in 8 years. As fans, we deserve better. "The process" and "patience" is team propaganda put out to make sure fans continue to buy into a franchise and spend their hard earned money on a team that has consistently over promised and under delivered.

What's wrong with wanting/ demanding more?

And lastly I'll say this...its not about what moves Botterill has made, its about the moves he hasn't made. Getting rid of players such as Girgensons, Okposo, Sobotka (who's actually on the 2nd line to start the year LOL) are simple moves that improve the makeup of the team simply by subtracting them. Bury them in the minors, ship them to Russia, I don't really care. The team did it with Moulson, and they should do it again.

It's not a great time to want to dump 5 million dollar players for a 7th. And when they have multiple years like okposo, you are probably looking at either adding something pretty nice, or taking back an equally terrible contract and hoping you can make it work. One of the op's points was adding a second to okposo for the expansion draft. I don't think that flies. We probably have a name d that will be exposed, and after Mcphee took Vegas to the cup, nobody wants your warts for a second.

I beg to differ. Respectfully.

Your statement that "it has been proven it only takes 1-2 years to turn around a franchise" implies that this is a straightforward task that should the standard outcome. I would like to know what teams you think were "turned around" in the last decade -- positively. (My hangdog Kings were turned around, all right, but not in the direction I'd hoped.) I think the more common outcome (in any professional sport) of rebuilding efforts is modest improvement unless and until a bolt from the blue pushes the team forward (like getting to draft Sidney Crosby). Canadian fans have been waiting years for Edmonton and Vancouver to become relevant, and the Coyotes franchise is the Ottoman Empire of the NHL. From the outside, Botterill seems to me to have done a pretty good job. Even the Radar O'Reilly trade may turn out better if Thompson and Montour improve to their hoped-for potential.

Yes, you should "demand more," but the patience for which gerowrj16 is asking is to be satisfied with contending for the playoffs this year. I sure would be happy for that from my local Ducks, but I have NO hope that this is a reasonable expectation for my Kings.

Idle thought: if Botterill manages to move Ristolainen somewhere for a 2020 first-round pick, and maybe adds a second-rounder too (even if it means exchanging a few lower ones), you should be able to fill a chartered bus to spend a nice June weekend in Montreal having a great time cheering your lungs out in an enemy arena.

I understand that, but there is nothing stopping the Sabres from burying Sobotka/ Girgensons for 1 year in the minors. Sure they won't get much salary relief but the it will allow for younger and potentially better players to replace them. We've seen what these vets have to offer and it continues to drive the sabres overall to the bottom of the standings. Okoposo is tougher since he has a few years left on his deal, but who cares? send him to Roch and let him provide veteran leadership from the minors.

There cap isn't an issue and if these players are negatively impacting the NHL club they should not be here.

Fair points. I didn't mean to come off to harsh but the reality is in today's NHL teams typically do not go 8 years without making the playoffs at least once. Especially when you include the new lottery draft format. The Sabres haven't even come close to the playoffs and that's the problem.

For example:

2015-2016 Leafs. Finished 30th, won lottery; next year made playoffs.

2016-2017 Devils. Finished 27th, won lottery; next year made playoffs.

2017-2018 Sabres. Finished 31st, won lottery; next year finished 27th

It doesn't take years and years like it used to if you have a competent front office.

I agree. Botterill actually chose to sign girgensons, its not like he got stuck with him and now needs to bury him. I would have moved on from him and several other anonymous henchmen just to get different guys in the room. Okposo probably gets buried at some point. I thought his speed was an issue when we got him, hes not getting faster.

Don't worry, you didn't come off "harsh"; that's why I included the word "Respectfully." I am enjoying this discussion.

Your points are well taken. But I'd like to point out that after the Maple Leafs drafted Auston Matthews, they landed John Tavares as a free agent, and they also had Morgan Rielly, William Nylander and Mitch Marner from three different draft years, so they haven't been an overnight sensation. And the year after the Devils got to the playoffs, they were so bad that they got back into the lottery and landed Jack Hughes -- and they haven't made the playoffs this year, yet.

You've got a year to clear out the deadwood. Who knows -- with Bogosian, Scandella, Girgensons and probably Ristolainen gone, you might see Botterill make some crazy move like buying up Loui Eriksson's contract in exchange for a lottery pick and then landing someone like David Pastrnak. Stay the course. Would you rather watch the Kings?

By the way, where were all you guys when I asked Buffalo fans about Nick Bjugstad for your #2C?

I think hes more of a 3rd line center. If we had room i would do it, just to trade him at the deadline when playoff gms decide that they better get bigger for the playoffs. We are talking about bodies that we cant move that need to be moved out just to get a look at some kids. Plus we are close to the cap. Theres just no room right now

My prediction is that soon you'll be moving Ristolainen, so there will be plenty of room.

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You all know I love Betterall. Let's all remember the team he inherited.
No defense, Ristolainen, Bogosian and McCabe were the only NHL quality defensemen and how many games did the last 2 play his first year, 71? Ristolainen was rushed to the NHL the year after he was drafted, played on a very bad team and never learned how to play defense.
No cap space, Bogosian, Moulson, Okposo, nearly $17,000,000 of dead cap, nearly 25% of the cap for 15 goals, and 13 games on defense.
No secondary scoring. After Kane, Eichel, O'Reilly and Reinhart who was there, Pouliot, Pomenville and ???.
A rudderless locker room, how many of you remember Nolan declaring that there was no accountability? Tell me who is responsible to hold the players accountable? The on ice leaders, we all know them, we call them captain.
Other teams cast offs, Lehner-a bipolar alcoholic, Kane-an off ice womanizer, an on ice selfish skater, O'Reilly-"I lost my love of the game" Captain!
I know everyone cries about O'Reilly, but what did he ever do for Buffalo, 81, 78 and 62, the points Buffalo had his 3 years here. BTW, when did STL turn it around, oh yes when Binnington joined the team. The Blues missed the playoffs by one point the previous year and they add Peron, Bozak and O'Reilly but were in last place until Jordan went crazy and won 49 out of 60 pts.
What has Betterall done?
The team now has up to 8 NHL quality defensemen and he added, Pilut, Gilmour, (two free agents) Miller, Montour, Jokiharju, Dahlin, Scandella for a first, second, Nylander and Foligno (and of course the first over all).
Still working on the cap space, but at least Moulson is off of the books.
Vesey, Johansson and Sheary added to the team for a third and a fourth has improved our secondary scoring. BTW Vesey was a great trade, not only will he get his 17 goals this year, but did you notice he also kills penalties?
Based on the performance of the first game it would appear the locker room issues have been resolved with the additions of Johansson and McCabe as the alternate captains.
We can all cry about the O'Reilly trade, but he never lead the Sabres to a winning season, much less the playoffs or Stanley cup. Last year, I noticed a more active Eichel, playing 200 feet of the ice, hmm did his lazy leader leave the team? This year, I saw him fighting for the puck in the defensive zone corners, he never did that 2 year ago.
As for the rebuild taking 2 to 3 years, we wasted 3 years of a rebuild with Murray. He had a great prospect pool, great draft picks and talent to trade from the NHL club. When he left we had one of the worse prospect pools, a last place team and no extra draft picks. BTW the Amerks missed the playoffs every year he was GM. The Amerks have made the play off both year Betterall was GM.
IMO the rebuild started when the Sabres drafted Dahlin, and the locker room problems gone.
There is my tome, let me add, Girgensons and Larsson started in the OZ only 16% of the time last year but managed to have a 50% Corsi, the team has one of the better PK's and if the GK was better, they may have had a top 5 PK. With only 16% OZ starts they still managed 11 goals. If any of you watched last year's playoffs the Jackets used Dubinsky as their face off specialist and he had only 6 goals and his salary is about double of Girgensons and Larsson combined.
So this is the second year of the rebuild, let's see how the season ends.

I think Sabres are definitely headed in the right direction. But again, ROR may've not been a good fit in Buffalo but shoulda fielded a better return. But he's been a good GM overall imo.

Its heading the right way. The backbone is there- a franchise center, a franchise d, and two top 10 picks in mittelstadt and cozens that would nicely fill some sore spots if/when they arrive. Olofsson looks like an incredible late round find, and combined with skinner and reinhart, there is stuff to like. There definitely needs to be progress this year, you cant keep stacking together bottom 10 finishes forever, but this should be a bubble team if the centers not named eichel can do a respectable job. I dont love all of his moves, but whatever, if it gets us where we wanna go...

Just really need Mittelstadt to become that legit 2C soon.

Its likely either that or wait for cozens. I dont think asplund is a 2. Gonna be tough to trade for one for at least this year, with salary cap considerations not helping.

That D core is shaping up nicely though, especially on the right side. Love the Joki and Miller trade for Buffalo.

We also still have Pilut and Montour to put into the lineup after they recover.... get rid of Scandella but don’t know after that

I think future pairings could be:
Dahlin-Joki
Pilut-Miller
X-Montour

McCabe will be the last defenseman pairing with until prospects are ready to go